The Co-operative Cloud
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00:00
InternetworkingUnternehmensarchitekturRechenschieberSoftwareSystemaufrufDeskriptive StatistikProjektive EbeneWinkelDienst <Informatik>Bildgebendes VerfahrenService providerSoftwareKartesische KoordinatenPunktwolkeData MiningInternetworkingWeb SiteMomentenproblemDifferenteRechenschieberGruppenoperationUnternehmensarchitekturCASE <Informatik>SichtenkonzeptAutonomic ComputingShape <Informatik>DiagrammComputeranimation
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Autonomic ComputingZeitzoneWeb SiteSichtenkonzeptPunktEndliche ModelltheorieEntscheidungstheorieProzess <Informatik>Web SiteComputeranimation
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Web SiteZeitzoneAutonomic ComputingTropfenUnendlichkeitElement <Gruppentheorie>WikiOrdnung <Mathematik>PunktStochastische AbhängigkeitCodeGruppenoperationSystemaufrufAutonomic ComputingRechter WinkelFreewarePunktwolkeMailing-ListePhysikalisches SystemSelbst organisierendes SystemSpeicherabzugSoftwareE-MailOffene MengeElement <Gruppentheorie>Web SiteComputeranimation
07:45
MultiplikationsoperatorPlastikkarteOpen SourceServerPunktwolkeRechenschieberGruppenoperationApp <Programm>Klassische PhysikTrennschärfe <Statistik>DifferenteInstallation <Informatik>Web SiteComputeranimation
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ExistenzsatzTurtle <Informatik>MereologieVirtualisierungVollständiger VerbandApp <Programm>GruppenoperationTrennschärfe <Statistik>Basis <Mathematik>Endliche ModelltheoriePunktwolkeWeb SiteGebäude <Mathematik>DigitalisierungBildgebendes VerfahrenDatenbankSchlussregelHilfesystemEinfach zusammenhängender RaumBitSoftwareentwicklerKonfigurationsraumOpen SourceHackerPhysikalisches SystemDokumentenserverTeilbarkeitEntscheidungstheorieAutonomic ComputingSpeicherabzugAggregatzustandInformationKeller <Informatik>Arbeit <Physik>SoftwareFreewareDebuggingDifferenteWort <Informatik>PunktBenutzerbeteiligungUmwandlungsenthalpieLesezeichen <Internet>PhasenumwandlungOrtsoperatorProjektive EbeneComputeranimation
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MereologieDigitalsignalSystemverwaltungGruppenoperationFamilie <Mathematik>MomentenproblemRückkopplungCASE <Informatik>Front-End <Software>DifferenteMatrizenrechnungKonstruktor <Informatik>PunktwolkeProzess <Informatik>Physikalisches SystemMereologieBestimmtheitsmaßDreiecksfreier GraphMultiplikationsoperatorE-MailKonfigurationsraumBasis <Mathematik>Ordnung <Mathematik>Wort <Informatik>BitApp <Programm>DifferenzkernOpen SourceProjektive EbeneSystemverwaltungProdukt <Mathematik>DokumentenserverGemeinsamer SpeicherEntscheidungsverfahrenFormale GrammatikBildgebendes VerfahrenBenutzerbeteiligungArithmetische FolgeNebenbedingungSuite <Programmpaket>SoftwareGleichgewichtspunkt <Spieltheorie>Peer-to-Peer-NetzCodeComputeranimation
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SystemverwaltungFokalpunktKollaboration <Informatik>RechnernetzApp <Programm>Open SourceKonfigurationsraumStandardabweichungStandardabweichungClientElektronische PublikationSoftwareGruppenoperationKollaboration <Informatik>KonfigurationsraumZentrische StreckungApp <Programm>Äußere Algebra eines ModulsRadikal <Mathematik>MatrizenrechnungPunktwolkeOnline-KatalogPunktPhysikalisches SystemGemeinsamer SpeicherProjektive EbeneVersionsverwaltungAuswahlaxiomKette <Mathematik>ServerFokalpunktOpen SourceDateiformatWhiteboardKonfigurationsverwaltungBootstrap-AggregationProdukt <Mathematik>DokumentenserverLastWellenpaketIdeal <Mathematik>RechenschieberWrapper <Programmierung>SoftwareentwicklerFaserbündelInstallation <Informatik>Bildgebendes VerfahrenDienst <Informatik>MathematikHypermediaMomentenproblemComputeranimation
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DigitalsignalGeradeSystemprogrammSchreiben <Datenverarbeitung>ClientPhysikalisches SystemZahlenbereichSpeicherabzugMobiles EndgerätBinärcodePunktwolkeInverser LimesKlasse <Mathematik>MultiplikationsoperatorSkalierbarkeitAutonomic ComputingServerFormale SpracheEntscheidungstheorieMAPDatenparallelitätDebuggingSystemaufrufPunktOpen SourceClientResultanteJensen-MaßMomentenproblemProdukt <Mathematik>BetafunktionSoftwareProgrammLeistung <Physik>DateiformatBenutzerbeteiligungInstallation <Informatik>KonfigurationsraumInterface <Schaltung>VersionsverwaltungCodecGrenzschichtablösungApp <Programm>SoftwareentwicklerSoftwarewartungComputeranimation
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SystemprogrammGeradeSchreiben <Datenverarbeitung>ClientDigitalsignalOffene MengePunktwolkeServerStabilitätstheorie <Logik>AggregatzustandApp <Programm>MultiplikationSkalierbarkeitATMLastPhysikalisches SystemLaufzeitfehlerSystemaufrufDesign by ContractInverser LimesWikiInstallation <Informatik>Open SourceSoftwareGruppenoperationPunktwolkeServerArbeit <Physik>Projektive EbeneHypermediaDämon <Informatik>PunktHackerKonfigurationsraumMailing-ListeGleitendes MittelUmwandlungsenthalpieWeb SiteMultiplikationsoperatorWorkstation <Musikinstrument>Autonomic ComputingSelbst organisierendes SystemZentrische StreckungIntegralAdressraumBitDienst <Informatik>Service providerRechter WinkelComputerarchitekturComputeranimation
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IRIS-TKontextbezogenes SystemKartesische KoordinatenSchreib-Lese-KopfMinkowski-MetrikComputeranimation
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PunktwolkePeer-to-Peer-NetzMinkowski-MetrikDienst <Informatik>VererbungshierarchieKeller <Informatik>Projektive EbeneSystemaufrufVideokonferenzGruppenoperationWeb SiteKontextbezogenes SystemMomentenproblemPunktDigitale PhotographiePerspektiveServerComputeranimation
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App <Programm>Autonomic ComputingBetafunktionVerschiebungsoperatorSelbst organisierendes SystemCAN-BusProdukt <Mathematik>HackerMetrisches SystemKeller <Informatik>UnternehmensarchitekturGruppenoperationWeb logOpen SourceMailing-ListePunktApp <Programm>MomentenproblemDigitalisierungSchnittmengeMultiplikationsoperatorInformationDifferenteRechenschieberProzess <Informatik>AuswahlverfahrenPunktwolkeInternetworkingInstantiierungSharewareGleitendes MittelProjektive EbeneSoftwareUnordnungVersionsverwaltungStandardabweichungSystemverwaltungRelativitätstheorieSystemaufrufServerBitTermSoftwareentwicklerBenutzerbeteiligungProgrammfehlerSpieltheorieComputeranimation
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GammafunktionE-MailMeta-TagMatroidCOMDezimalzahlNotepad-ComputerServerTypentheorieApp <Programm>DokumentenserverKonfigurationsraumVersionsverwaltungPunktwolkeInterface <Schaltung>ClientVerzeichnisdienstTrennschärfe <Statistik>Projektive EbeneSoftwarewartungWorkstation <Musikinstrument>Dienst <Informatik>InternetworkingBasis <Mathematik>Nichtlinearer Operator
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SharewareW3C-StandardInterface <Schaltung>DreizehnComputeranimationFlussdiagramm
Transkript: Englisch(automatisch erzeugt)
00:05
Yeah, sure great. Yeah. Sorry for the old the usual sure. I'm sure you're used to it now Great to see so many people here amazing. Thanks for your interest in the co-op cloud Yeah, my yeah, I'm decentralized. That's my internet name. And these are my enter enterprise slides
00:24
For the co-op clouds, so I've been working on this project now for Yeah, maybe two to three years. I would say so There's a lot of knowledge of the project how it happened and What came to pass locked up in my head, but I am only one person involved in this project. What has now become
00:46
Quite a wonderful project I'd say which involves a lot of different collectives a lot of different groups so yeah, this is just kind of like a moment to offload what we've been up to for the last two years and Yeah, all the hot takes are mine. I'm mine alone
01:02
At some of the images are taken from Yeah, shout out to fellow worker Trav The internet gardening collection on arena. I totally recommend checking that out. It's great So yeah call cloud This is the official Website ready description of what the cooperative cloud is a software stack
01:24
that aims to make hosting Libra software applications simple for small service providers Such as tech coops who are looking to standardize around open transparent and scalable infrastructure, which is a lot So I was thinking how am I gonna explain this Because we come straight in with a software stack, but actually it's much more than that
01:44
I think you could argue our project is more a social endeavor social organizing more than a technical thing But of course they're overlapping So I thought well, okay. We'll just go back We'll do it like a you know history lesson on how the project started and and
02:02
I feel like that is an important angle for introducing the project. So I Want you to understand where the project is coming from and then maybe you feel welcome to join the project And shape the future of the project, right? and I think this historical view on where things are coming helps to
02:22
ground the project in an actual Need human need there's a lot of software projects out there that are just like why does this exist, you know but we're trying to show that this is socially useful and Why we have come up with this project and initiated and tried to make it work is based on
02:43
What we needed at the time, but that may not necessarily be the case in the future So, yeah put that to one side and let me introduce you to the magic brain of autonomic co-op So these are some people in the co-op. There's me on the banjo
03:03
That's not all of them there's 13 of us As far as I remember we have a new website that was just put up last night. So check it out. It's hilarious I don't know if I can Get up here, but I'll try maybe at some point So, yeah, we're at technology Cooperative I work our own cooperative. That means the people who work in the business own the business. It's run and managed by ourselves
03:26
and that means we're yeah, this is like a You know, we when we come into where we work We have the chance to make decisions about every aspect of how the workplace runs So, you know, what kind of work do we want to do? How do we want to make decisions?
03:43
How do we deal with money how do we find new work who do we want to work with Another member wants to work with this group, but someone else disagrees with that. How do we work this out? How do we deal with conflict? It's kind of an end-to-end Workplace situation where you you you have the chance to you know be involved in every step of the process
04:06
And of course you don't have to do that alone You can do that with your friends. So That's the kind of model of the cooperative Yeah, and the One of the kind of
04:21
Yeah, I'll come back to the website maybe in a bit but So one of the the ideas behind What a cooperative is Is this listing of cooperative principles? You can see them on the right hand side there for example autonomy independence
04:41
You know economic participation of the members open voluntary membership These are kind of like non-binding principles of what it means to be a co-op Principle six for example that you will work with other co-ops So, you know, we want to expand cooperation in the ecosystem of groups that are trying to do this as well
05:00
And a lot of these hinge on Actually having Money to survive in order to practice what it means to be a cooperative So we're a technology cooperative And what do we do exactly and you could kind of say we do basically Everything and anything like we would happily develop a new piece of software, but we'd also come to your house and fix your toaster
05:27
We you know We try to work with people that we want to work with that We want to support that we like their work or that connect with our values and One of the things we've done quite successfully in my opinion is to run a free software step or internally and for the people we work
05:44
with So we we have like, you know, all the things we use our free software So we're pretty we're pretty good at that and managing our own internal infrastructure And so necessarily we would then just offer that to groups like
06:01
Do you want a website do you want your own chat system like a matrix or do you want a wiki or do you? Want an X cloud or whatever this kind of stuff this classic hosting situation? and One of this one of these problems that has come up Autonomics running like several years now five years or so Is that it's difficult to make money when you just do hosting?
06:24
People are used to just getting stuff for free for very understandable reasons big tech And at some point You know, we want to scale out the code. We want to involve more people We want to be able to make a living from it want to be able to survive Pay the rent and so on and then we started realizing that okay
06:42
Actually, we're making more money or people are happy to pay us more when we are doing support and this is talking to people Getting on a call and being like what is software and then talking about it or what is a wiki everyone saying wiki? I don't know what wiki is And just having a chat about it, but then also
07:03
Being around later. So once they ask for the thing Like an X cloud you set it up and then you don't disappear because you're a cooperative and you intend to continue So sustainability is one of the core principles. So we stick with them. We we chat we're contact on mail and so on
07:23
so This is kind of the dilemma of like we want to definitely do more hosting because People need digital infrastructure to do their work. This is just like a base layer of how to organize things But it's difficult to survive as a technology cooperative only doing hosting so you need to like expand what you do
07:47
And one of the one of the places we ended up was using cloud run which is a kind of like One click install open source system, which I would still recommend it's great It got us really far a lot of the next slides criticizes. So I'm just gonna say it's great on this slide
08:07
We yeah, but so, you know, you can see like you have your Classic selection of open source apps if you if you're familiar with that stuff like rocket chat For example, we use rocket chat to communicate where you know in in the co-op And what this enabled us to do was basically
08:25
Work with different groups that may not necessarily have money to support us like to make it sustainable to work with them But still Support them to do their work and cloud run was like a really kind of like go jail card in that sense
08:42
It was like, okay I can just like hit five times on this WordPress button and We've got five WordPress sites and people are going they're posting they're organizing they're working we're supporting them. It's brilliant You know and for for those who don't know cloud run is just like you fire up the server the SSH into it you run a command it spins up this thing and
09:04
You're you're going here. You can install multiple apps on the same server. So this really reduces the costs for rolling out digital infrastructure Let me check time sir, right? So yeah, remember I said a cloud runs cool, but
09:28
At some point The core of the park the the front end the web front end became proprietary. So they made a switch In some sense. I can't blame them because as I said if you want to survive You need to make a book and you need to pay the rent and so on
09:42
But yeah that made us nervous You know when we work with people as a cooperative we want to say we'll be around for you We want to continue we want to do this sustainably And if you remember one of the principles is like our independence like how? Like can we exist in this world?
10:02
You know, there's of course interdependencies, but like can we continue to do what we want to do without relying on one specific thing? So When this so Cloudera made the decision to make the front-end proprietary you can still use or whatever it's a great system But we thought oh no What what's gonna happen?
10:23
And then we started looking a bit deeper and we realized that Clouderon when you click and install an app the apps are Yeah, they're it's an image so use a container system, it's kind of like a light virtualization layer
10:43
They're packaging all the apps Themselves so the people who work in Clouderon Inc or whatever When they want to provide a new app they say okay, let's make a new git repository and let's package this thing And that's great and it works really well
11:01
But then we realized that They had packaged I can't remember specific apps, but take for example Next cloud they had gone and some worker in Clouderon had packaged next cloud But then we went to the upstream next cloud repository, and we saw they had provided an image, and then we thought well Why aren't we just working with them because that would you know?
11:22
Can echo our values a little expanding cooperation in different layers of the software stack and so on and then the more we look we realize that free software communities were Really converging on the idea that you have a packaged image inside your repository So you're hacking on your source code, and you just have an image. That's building and we can use that
11:43
That's what Clouderon needs so we were like okay. That's interesting. Maybe let's think about that yeah, and then the kind of like the end of the you know the logical end of the paranoia or whatever was that like we have You know we were relying on this one
12:03
Company this one group You know Autonomic is is a cooperative that supports maybe Yeah, 20-plus groups But like a large selection of them have very little money to pay for the infrastructure So if you can imagine that Clouderon would somehow make a bigger step into more proprietary solutions or somehow
12:25
Increase the cost or who knows what? We'd be in a position where we can't support those groups And that's not something we wanted to to deal with so we we started to try to think like You know we're a co-op. How did we make this better or whatever and?
12:43
That is the start of called cloud, so now we're getting back into Another take on that original really long sentence that had things like software sack in it Yeah, we were like let's just eliminate this issue of proprietary
13:01
You know angles or whatever. Oh, yeah, here's where I just couldn't get the emoji in the slide, so I just gave up I Yeah, we're just like we'll just copy left the entire thing let's just do that that seems sensible Cool and then as I mentioned a year eternal favorite emoji We want to work with the upstream
13:23
developers of the software because a lot of Precarity is in the open source ecosystem, and that there's you know certain developers Which are doing unpaid labor to develop the software that a lot of us rely on? And they're providing these you know a lot of them are providing these packages, and we thought well, okay
13:43
We can just meet them where they're at Engage with them on the issue tracker You know speak to them make them aware of our Hosting efforts, and you know we're we're in a sense like closer to end users
14:01
In that you know it's like developers hosters users Summarized and often developers well They've got their hands full trying to make the software work, so we can like help that connection So we're trying to bridge that in that sense And also, which we'll see later on
14:22
They're also providing so they're packaging up their their apps in in images, but they're also providing this kind of extra Configuration around it which kind of tells you how to deploy the thing which is great for people who are doing hosting because Okay, we have an app, but does it need a database for example, so what database?
14:43
But they're also doing that for us as well, so if you develop our software. Thank you Yeah, and then the democratic governance We were gonna initiate this project. Let's say now. I wouldn't say we like invented it We just like collude a bunch of stuff together
15:03
But we wanted to not be in control of that so not become the new Clouderon which Is like okay? Let's set up some clear rules for how do you interact with this project and also? On what basis are you also a technology cooperative?
15:20
Are you an open source developer? Are you a user of the software? Do you want to support the host or do you want to support the device? You know we can we can start to like engage with it where we're at But meet in this kind of like you know common projects and obviously the goal then is to like sustain open source digital infrastructure You know
15:41
and expand cooperation Yeah, so Moving out of the kind of history phase and now into what it actually is Yes So this word kind of pops up if you've checked the website or the docs
16:03
Democratic tech collectives, so what is that actually? We are so Autonomic is a more publicly registered in the UK. We're publicly regulated. We're a cooperative society You know we have gone through
16:21
The paperwork to make that happen because we wanted to do that But we recognize that not everyone will want to do that or be able to do that And this really depends on a per country basis like if you're in the Netherlands It's a different model or fee in the UK like the way you relate to the legal system and the state is like
16:45
You know in Germany. It's quite difficult. I've been told there's no way to kind of just like slot yourself in you're like Yeah It's not like very easy to find information And we don't want that to be a limiting factor in
17:00
working together, so we were trying to conceptualize this idea of like What other groups would we be willing to work with but not close that definition down from the outside So we were thinking about other groups who have You know that want to work with their friends or together with other groups
17:23
And I've set up decision-making for example collective decision-making so they're able to like navigate what they want to do together That was kind of like a thing we wanted to do we want to be able to interact with each other We want to be able to disagree and receive and send constructive feedback reach compromise stuff like this
17:42
This is this is kind of easier to do when people are already organized in their own groups but Yeah, this this didn't really rule out individuals who are active in the project at the moment and also other technology cooperatives We're kind of just trying to like saddle through it somehow
18:02
And be like just work with us. You know let's figure it out together, and this is already in progress This has been in progress for some time The formalization of what this means and that's an open process which would love to invite you to to come check out The configuration Commons
18:21
this is a So as I said before we have open source apps Then we can package them in images, and then we can specify a configuration around those images to describe how? That app should look like in a deployment on a server live and well people using it and one of the things we know is was that the as I said before the
18:44
The configuration that was being provided by the upstream repositories Was useful, but it didn't specify the full kind of end-to-end production Kind of scenario, and that's kind of a big word But for example how to back up the app data like the thing is deployed people are using it
19:04
And we need to make sure their data is safe, so we need to back it up How do we back the thing up? How do we restore it? This is kind of like a step from it works to It works, and it's safe for these people to use it and we Wanted to encapsulate that into our
19:20
configuration So this is a big part of it. We'll go through each one of these Deeper, I'm just going to overview them now Yeah, Abra is a command-line tool so our own digital tools We wanted to be involved in how the tools are shaped and how we use them You know that's that's a great
19:41
Situation where your dog food in your own system with your peers, and you're trying to figure out How does this how does this you know best suit us you know and according to our own? Constraints you know we can't spend all day learning this obscure system, or we can't You know invest too much time in some things so we need to cut corners, and it's best to be involved directly in that
20:04
process so Yeah, and if we remember back to the cloud on again, I'm sorry I'm not don't want to be bashing them at all but Yeah, like how do we interact with the system in the case of cloud Ron it was a web front-end But if we're talking about interacting with technology cooperatives and other tech collectives
20:27
There's kind of a difference to begin with because cloud Ron is maybe trying to provide for the say Let's let's say non technical user or someone who can just kind of get in click a few buttons or whatever But we're already dealing with groups that are actively like you know deeply involved with like Linux system
20:44
Administration and so on so do we need a front end So those are the kind of Questions we can ask and answer them ourselves in those moments And the collective infrastructure So there's a lot that goes on in between
21:03
Getting an app out and someone using it You know people have to meet each other and talk and who are you and what's going on? And what do you do and all this kind of stuff and then money? Where does the money go? Who you know, what do you charge? You know, it's just this end to end all the social processes that go in and around that
21:22
we wanted to build those up too because That is a huge problem when you're starting off as a collective and you're like, oh no, where's my bank account? Like how do I get a bank account and you can see like open collective for example doing this Just like mutualizing this financial infrastructure and just getting people going So yeah docs
21:43
Yeah get hosting Again off github. That's cool Stuff like that. So I'm gonna go through these a bit deeper Yeah, we're we're trying to form so we're our proposal at the moment as
22:01
autonomic, which is Yeah, now I can say the sentence and I hope it's a bit clear We initiated this project and we're deeply embedded inside it But we're attempting to step out of the project and re-enter on an equal basis with other collectives So in order to do that, we're proposing a Federation model, which is based on a great project called co-op cycle
22:27
If you've heard of it, but basically different groups can interact with each other There will be democratic decision-making and yeah some laws and we'll come up with a constitution together and all this kind of stuff I couldn't fit in on this line, but it's not just chaotic nerds. It's also
22:44
Open to you know, we can imagine The people who are using the software grouping together and joining our Federation as well to say Hey this button should be over there. Could you just fix that but in a more collective sense like
23:00
We could be gathering money we could be figuring out how to improve things You know, you don't have to be able to just write software to join this kind of stuff We could be you know, connecting the different struggles To build up to build up like a better Open source ecosystem. So this is this is a process that's going on right now
23:24
There's invites going out. We have a new round of private funding. Thank you for the funder and Yeah, there'll be no more news, but check the website if you're interested in this if you're also part of a collective love to Hear from you
23:40
This is a massive problem that we of course experiences being since I'm and we've seen a lot of people join in on the old matrix channels and You know, they'd that'd be one person setting up a few apps for friends family Maybe their local community a food co-op. What have you
24:00
And then a few months down the line. It's completely overwhelming The email broke, you know, or it doesn't do this or who knows? Well, if you do any sysadmin, you'll know the story But when you step into the code cloud project you have this chance to Meet your peers who are also doing this work. They may not be involved in your project whatsoever, but that's not important
24:25
we have this idea of the the config comments that means We can share work on the Again, the next cloud Recipe, that's what we call them. We'll come to that in a bit So we can work together on the same configuration and
24:44
That means we're sharing tips tricks. We're talking together. You know, it's like this group of users wants this Do you want that? Oh, I tried this, you know this kind of stuff and this is really Yeah, this this has been seen to be Like a great feature of trying to just like open the door for people to come in and work together
25:05
Because there's a lot of There's a lot of tools that propose reuse and kind of mind share and a you know collective point of reference but Don't really live up to that
25:23
You know the the the ideal of reuse just not doing it again, you know Repeating yourself. So we were conscious of that. We're trying to work on that Yeah, focus on training collaboration. So we wanted it to be Easy to on board. We want more
25:40
Democratic tech collectives to pop up. We want more technology cooperatives to be able to start We want people to be able to decide I want to own and run my own workplace and I want to You know bootstrap some infrastructure for groups. I find cool in my city And and that's what called cloud is about it's like a tool set for these people
26:01
It has to be easy to use of course, and we're very focused on that public. So groups Who have already decided that that's what they want to do They're on the terminal at the moment. We only have the terminal clients And they're you know, they're getting into that, you know, we can't do everything for everyone, but we can definitely
26:22
With that public in mind we can you know be focused and how we attempt to make it accessible and usable and Yes cooperating with other networks. So we want to you know within our network, of course, we want to have groups join But for the groups that don't want to join we still want to work with them if they have the same values if they're
26:43
Doing similar things we can also interface with them and we've already seen that Happening and I'll come back to that in a bit. But You know Once things are clear and they're getting clear like we are a group of cooperatives. We have this configuration Commons have these tools
27:01
We're just like specifying what we are then it's easier for other groups to say Okay, I understand what's happening here and I would like to do this with you So there's kind of like, you know a concrete example find funding together So, yeah The conflict Commons yes the open source apps you love if you
27:25
it's it's this catalog of softwares that is out there and people are Developing the next cloud the media wikis the synapses Gittier get to the whole thing. So we have we have quite an expanding
27:40
Comfort common so that you can like to ploy a lot of apps So that that's a thing like People come to us and they're like, oh I need a calendar or all I need You know a note-taking app or I know whatever and then we're out hunting in the open source ecosystem for apps to to to add to the catalog, so
28:01
That's that then the yes, so to come back to the You know this again this idea of the the image is the app which is the packaged Thing and then the the kind of wrapper around that which specifies the end-to-end kind of how they should look in production And we were conscious to not reinvent a
28:21
packaging format and We didn't really know what to do at that point because we thought okay we We need to be able to say how you know in one file Let's say in plain text a conflict file. Like here's the app and how do you back it up? How do you restore it? How do you take it down? How do you bring it up?
28:41
How do you configure it? How do you plug it, you know this kind of stuff? Yeah, and as it turns out the Docker Compose ecosystem and Docker has kind of been moving towards The Compose standard they're calling it and it's basically yeah, if you've ever seen the Docker Compose file It's a YAML text file and it kind of just specifies
29:04
What we're looking for so we just figured great upstream Developers are already using this This is a developing open standard great let's just build on this and I think as it turns out that was a good choice and has had many benefits which we'll come to on the next slide
29:26
yeah, so we're working with upstream developers and yeah, we're so in in my background, I've done a lot of configuration management tool like for example working with Ansible Which was always the the grand ideal of reusing roles if anyone has been
29:44
used Ansible before It's kind of like a packaging format for you know, you have a server and you want to install Like Apache on it or something and you tell Ansible install Apache for me and then You want to install the new thing and then you kind of package this into a role and at some point
30:05
I realized that everybody is writing the same roles There's like it's very difficult to like share and to reuse other people's stuff It's definitely happening but not on the scale that I was looking for. And so I was looking for alternatives
30:20
Yeah, so in in the project so far we've seen people like we we have For example matrix service synapse installs we've seen multiple collectives Look at the config and say this works for me. I'm going to use this and then Changing the config in collaboration with other groups. So we're already seeing that people are able to make the changes that works for them without
30:46
Breaking other people's installs and then when things need to be worked out they speak to each other and things move along And again, the composed standard really helps here in that it's quite flexible And
31:01
helps us People can move around each other inside the configuration which will be hopefully become clear on the next slide. Yes, great. So We're calling the the app configuration a recipe cooking inspired And it's a gay repository here. You have get T get T. Still don't know
31:25
and It's a bunch of config files and as a collective you'll come here and look and say okay, this is the configuration which specifies you know how this thing should look like in a deployment and kind of one of the The magic sauce of this format is that if you've ever used I think it's the docker
31:46
I think it was a docker compose command-line client. You can kind of chain the compose files So you can say like docker compose up Compose that YAML minus F composed some other thing that YAML and the system will
32:01
Internally merge all of these configurations together and then roll out the app Which I never had occasion to use until I realized that maybe somebody you know wants to use Postgres And maybe someone wants to use Maria DB, right? some these simple
32:20
choices for deployments If it's not possible to kind of like Make this easy to do between different groups. It would never work out So very very thankful to the the people who wrote this Standard so you can see here you can kind of and it'll become clear when we talk about the command-line client
32:43
You can kind of specify. Okay, I want Maria DB and I want the SMTP config Bundle all together roll it out and I don't want Postgres or I don't want this or I don't want that And this allows people to just expand the config to suit their needs Document it let people know this is a new feature. So it's quite nice
33:01
You can be just hosting some software and suddenly says oh great open ID connect now works with this Just load this thing in and you know, this is really helping us move forward and get things done Um Yeah at the moment we have a command-line clients called Abra and this is the kind of day-to-day interface for how you manage your call cloud installed
33:24
So you have a server you deploy stuff to the server. You're using Abra on the command line And that was a real There was a large decision for us at the time because we didn't have Much money. We didn't know if we would be able to pull off a web front end
33:40
And again, as I mentioned before we were trying to target specifically like who is the public of this project? Are they people who know and are comfortable on the command line? Yes. Okay. Let's just go ahead with this and try to make it work So we wrote him bash the first one and I still completely recommend it just unleash your inner Unix
34:02
It was great. It's it managed to get us to You know zero to hero in Relatively short amount of time and have a system that was working one of the kind of Core ideas behind developing our own tools. We were very conscious that we might fail won't be able to get it done
34:24
And we wanted to have that the the conflict Commons would kind of live separately. So these would be kind of Not interdependent in a way that if one broke the other would break So if you even today if you just ignore that abra exists
34:40
You can still drop into the command line run a bunch of commands and roll out the app Which is great and that's kind of how we originally conceived it with the the bash system We're just running a bunch of commands and we had kind of like laid it all out in a way that kind of said okay, you can just Push that out. So yeah, thanks to Kay likes a fellow worker who is great at bash programming
35:04
We wouldn't have done it without them Yes, so then we rewrote and go we actually managed to get Some funding which will come to you after I guess they're not bash programmers if they read the source they might have felt otherwise but
35:22
At that point we were running into issues with the bathroom of implementation, which we felt quite proud about that we had like Gone ahead and found the limits of the simplest possible thing that we could do and The issues were it was difficult to install on multiple systems
35:42
it relied on a number of Built-in commands that were not always available on you know, like a fedora Debian or whatever So yeah portability We were struggling with we wanted to kind of develop Other Aspects of we like we wanted the tools to be able to speak to the config Commons but not directly powers each other
36:05
and that ended up being a kind of like JSON catalog, but then Parasing data formats and bash is difficult. So we were we're kind of pulling our hair out on that one and then concurrency We were struggling to manage horizontal scaling. So if you have work with 18 groups, they want to have their own VPS's
36:27
if you have 10 servers You know The tool has to like fire a request at each 10 of them or whatever and then if it's going through Each one at a time you have to wait and as a result of kind of scaling up and using this
36:43
absolutely pre alpha software and autonomic for production purposes, we reach the limits of the The software so we end up right rewriting it and go somebody new go in autonomic at the time. That's the reason But also we saw that it Was really, you know, we could get this concurrency issue sorted and the portability
37:05
so go kind of gives you a language level feature that it's like quite easy to say like fire a class of these 10 things immediately and You can build a binary so you can just fire them out. So people just get like a binary in the system and
37:20
This stuff is all baked into it So the new problem with this is that it actually works it's it's it's It does what it says and people are starting to use it. So we're now into this kind of maintenance cycle. It's It's kind of approach. We've done the public beta. So people are using it and starting to rely on it
37:41
And we've seen people hacking on it and submitting pull requests and checking it out and it's all good Yeah, so in essence Abra is a doctor swarm client. So no, we don't run kubernetes We run dr. Schwab and no it's not dead. Dr. Swarm is a technology that is still alive
38:04
We're kind of we have like a strange Pyrocynical relationship with like some installs like some banks have like a swarm install of like, you know, 10,000 nodes or something and The current owner, I believe it's Marantis or something. There's been an exchange of who owns it or who I can't remember but
38:25
We're it's still being maintained and we're happy to see that it is being maintained because we identify that Swarm mode in Docker is kind of the appropriate feature set that we need
38:41
Without having to deal with Going into learning how to You know roll out a large system, which is built for like large scale Are you know? And again, this is like what was autonomic doing at the time was like rolling out single servers deploying a few apps No greater than like 10 to 30 50 100 users or whatever
39:05
and Swarm mode provides you with the ability to kind of roll out the up and if it fails It'll roll it back for you and we can bake that into our config. So we were kind of getting the stability guarantees that we Needed and not a lot of groups were demanding, you know when they had like a media wiki installed. They weren't saying
39:23
There must be 99% uptime in this contract or whatever But we still wanted to push that to the limit like a high quality stable service when we're rolling stuff out this should be Yeah And then yeah, the this warm mode just covers that for us the the runtime to contain a run time
39:46
Yeah, this is a kind of like the abra architecture let's say so on the left You will install abra for example on your local workstation the command-line tool and then you'll buy
40:00
SSH kind of tell abra to manage this server so it'll read the SSH config and it'll connect to the server and say Okay, I recognize this server. I see there's a docker demon running on this and it's got swarm mode enabled cool And then it can you know, you can do this horizontal scale and we can have several servers so you can load multiple servers into
40:22
abra and then you can be Sharing the abra state between multiple people so in a copper of 13 people You Know each one who runs abra app LS or whatever to list the the apps and the servers
40:40
We'll see the same state come out and we can we can go into that a bit later So yeah, it's built for basically collaboration in in the organization that you're in and Then the other mode is you install abra directly on the server and it stores the state on the server Which could be useful if you're yeah for specific scenarios, this was a requested
41:05
Yeah, some people run this I don't myself Yeah, and then the final points moving on collective infrastructure, yeah docs git hosting Recipes that call cloud tech here. You can see the list of all the the apps we have
41:23
We have an open collective which is the fiscal host is autonomic bank account in the UK and That's been nice because we've been able to once we got the funding we were able to Tell people if you work on this we can pay you just immediately anything you do
41:42
you'll get paid and that's great because We know there's a lot of unpaid labor going on in open source world So we didn't want to be a project that said, you know contribute to our Commons and get nothing back No, we could actually pay, you know So we set like an hourly wage there and we said this is how much money we have and away you go That worked out great. I would say
42:02
And the server from servers co-op, so I wanted to plug this other project. That's you can go to the website servers co-op Yeah, we've been working with a group Who've been developing software calls capsule Siberia great hackers
42:20
And they're trying to develop a system well, they have developed a system which is basically a Server provider infrastructure like Hetzner, for example So VPS is you know, I need a server to roll one out. I need another server to roll one out And then we and a couple of other people myself included we're thinking okay, this is great because a lot of
42:47
Hetzner VPS's right and if Hetzner rolls up the price or you know We've already seen this with the increase in cost and IPv4 addresses and the 10% increase this year It's getting more costly to run on Hetzner, but it's always been super cheap and that's been super accessible
43:04
But it could change. So what do we do? We need to build up this Aspect of our stack so we kind of like expand the cooperative layer down to the servers And that is the idea behind servers co-op And Abra already Supports an integration so you can do like server new and if you've got a capsule running on your server, it'll spin up a VM
43:28
So we were already trying to like, you know, just take a turn into cooperatively managed infrastructure and build those integrations from the start Whether or not they're working that great is for me to be seen but
43:43
Yes, so European cultural foundation gave us upwards of 30 grand in funding last year and the year before For in the context of the culture of solidarity fund Those amazing thanks to them. They were really great and I would recommend applying to them. They support us the whole way through it was
44:03
Yeah, it's just just fantastic. We wrote our application and sent it into them. So Pretty happy with that one Great Nearly done. Yeah, I want to just chat. So this isn't vaporware. I again I want to plug like I just find it so important to explain that
44:21
People are actually using this and this isn't just like some idea in our heads and we think it's cool It's like people are actually running you know, they rely on some of the things that have been deployed so long like that space is a Project which is about like 13 apps. I think on a server somewhere which was initiated by a
44:42
Artist collective called wrong grouper, which is like an indonesian-based collective in the context of documenta And they wanted to kind of approach a group that connected with their values or in At some point they were so they were invited to document it to do the work and they thought okay
45:02
We're all the way over here Indonesia in the Indonesia and we need to work with people who are based in Europe So we're gonna need digital tools, but we don't want to be immediately going on the Google Drive's of the world So, how do we build up, you know extend our ways of working and our values into the digital realm? So then they came looking for collectives and coops
45:23
Friend put us through to them Yeah, and here's just some photos of us Just engaging in this massively multiplayer shared infrastructure project. So it was really great people From my perspective
45:41
understood what coop cloud was and the mission behind it and felt invited to kind of Look at the technology and what we were doing and comment on that and give this critique, you know We're we're often in the space where people want to talk about digital tools But the first thing they say is oh, I don't know anything about technology Which is kind of like a hallmark you have to like excuse yourself or something
46:03
But we got past that in working with this group of people that may not find themselves technical but as we moved on Again, call cloud allowed us to just kind of like deploy the tech and just like just forget about it And then go on with the support work
46:22
And we ended up with like the lot the last great thing I saw from this project was the people Involved in using the tools were publishing videos about how to use the tools In the stack, so they were like in the matrix chat and on the peer tube publishing. Here's how you use peer tube Amazing great educational practice totally check it out TV among that space is the website
46:47
Yeah This was another project. We met kind of in the context of documented. So this is a comic revert shaft is a comic illustrators union which is bootstrapping at the moment and They felt you know, they saw among the space and they were like this looks cool
47:05
And I like the idea of what is going, you know, I understand what is happening here. There are two groups cooperating here this kind of like cultural based initiative and this technology collective and You know, I can see the call cloud website and this looks like we want to check this out. So
47:24
We kind of got over that fear and anxiety and move through the the money exchange and you know, let's work together It was quite smooth So I would say call cloud is then helping us just again put these things to rest like this is the project We're based on you know, when we work when we deploy your infrastructure, it will be contributing to the Collins copy left
47:45
Democraticly managed, you know, you kind of just get over the hump And yeah Kotak is a new co-op which is sat in Poland and that was a major boost. So they've deployed a bunch of services as some members are in the room
48:02
Super nice Yeah, it's a software stack which is in its you know initiated developed by Cooperative so it should suit other cooperatives to bootstrap. And of course if you want to start a new technology cooperative How do you start it's overwhelming But now you've got this off-the-shelf
48:22
Project and it's like get going And once you enter it, you just see all the other collectors and you're like great We can we can learn we can share, you know, and again it expands beyond the technical So we have the infrastructure for payment and bank accounts and all this stuff. So people can really get moving fast. I think is
48:41
Is good and we want to expand the the you know We want people to start technology cooperatives start technology cooperatives Yes enterprise metrics 21 collectives Somebody counted them maybe it was me at some point, but there's a lot of groups involved in this you can if you go on
49:03
The the website it's in the blog post a list of them We've got 160 plus recipes. This is a lot of open source apps. You could probably find what you need in there And yeah, we're running a hundred and forty six apps, I think I ran a bra Bellis at some points
49:22
So autonomic is heavily invested in this and there are other collectors which are Running the stack Yeah, and and maybe just kind of coming to the end it's been a lot of details I'm even overwhelmed myself The last few slides kind of philosophy take
49:42
You know that We we wanted to be Another project in the ecosystem and not just become the project in relation to Decentralization, let's say we really posit ourselves in
50:00
You know against kind of this like big tech discourse and what's happening? and We thought we could contribute to You know internet and digital infrastructure decentralization by proposing call cloud in in its In its format and we're only one project So I thought it'd be good to plug some other great projects, which I just find super inspiring. I think
50:27
Like I would say you know is like maybe one of the gold standards of community organized Infrastructure hosting and it has a different kind of set of priorities and goals You know, everyone can be a system administrator is kind of their goal like, you know
50:43
Let's make information available to people anyone can do this get going Brilliant project whereas we're going for, you know specific groups co-ops You're already in the game. How can we make it easier to keep going? So it's a bit of the different layers, but absolutely recommend you know host
51:01
new boys based in Brussels check them out So Tom's great network co-tech is a network of cooperatives based in the UK I think it's like 35 cooperatives check them out. If you're looking for a job get stuck in Social co-op trying to build cooperatively managed Mastodon instances
51:21
local IT great collective already based in Involved in called cloud at the moment and small technology foundation. I always find inspiring check that out small tech Just plugging them. Yeah, Oh five minutes cool the roadmap is yeah, as I said building the Federation
51:42
So now is a great time to join You know as you're you know, again as an individual a collective a co-op Please get involved if you want to We're trying to find more money Of course one of the the goals is of the Federation is to kind of achieve financial financial sustainability
52:01
So the co-ops that join or the groups that join The project will be you know, we're gonna we're gonna have to decide. All right, how do we fund development of the tool? And can we pay for hours around finance admin triage just got you know, all this intense stuff
52:21
Yeah, Kadabra is a kind of new efforts So you kind of have a server side component, which is and this is the thing that cloud run did amazingly Well, which is just auto updating the apps So we're trying to replicate that in terms of the server side component, which understands You know, oh someone who takes care of that recipe has uploaded a new version. I'm gonna roll it out
52:46
And yeah web interface, I forgot to add maybe because it's still under discussion if we need that or not Yes get into the end I I have I could do a demo a chaos demo
53:00
Your demo Mmm, yeah, okay. Maybe I'll just do a cast demo so I wanted to like run Yes, just show you The command line clients so Again to contextualize this is the tool
53:22
that People who maintain the service will be running on a daily basis. So it's supposed to make the job easy and I won't go through all of it at the moment, but you know, it's it's You know, we try to take effort to like explain the concepts that are involved in the project and what you can do
53:46
You know you can list all the The recipes that are available from the command line, for example and Yeah, you can also do operations on recipes here so you can like attempt to upgrade
54:10
Oh, I probably don't have internet yeah, right, okay Well, anyway, you can kind of like do the maintenance commands on the spot So, you know again, you're on your local workstation. You realize that there's a new version of next cloud is coming out
54:22
Okay, let's get that upgraded and then you can run the commands here and that'll basically Operate on this directory ABBA recipes Well, you can see a selection of the apps and then you know, this is just the what I showed earlier the recipe repository. So
54:43
The this is the configuration that specifies how to deploy this app Yeah, and there's some other details that I didn't really go into but basically One of the nice things that we've wired up is that if you deploy this Up called traffic that when you roll out next cloud it automatically configures the less encrypt stuff
55:05
So you just don't have to deal with this HTTPS issue it's already in the config. You just say give me a thing Yeah, I don't know was there much more oh, yeah, I guess yeah, and then there's just kind of this like command-and-control
55:24
Interface where you can see like okay, what apps have I got on what servers and You know, what do I need to do and you can kind of like? You know filter it by server or whatever I won't type it out now, but yeah, maybe
55:42
I'll call it a day. Thank you for listening to me talk for so long