What the energy industry can learn from how open source technology has transformed other traditional industries
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00:00
Food energyOpen sourceInternet forumControl flowSystem programmingPower (physics)Computer networkGradientArithmetic meanPhysical systemGame controllerObject (grammar)Video gameError messagePower (physics)Food energyComputer architectureComputer animationMeeting/Interview
00:47
Type theoryService (economics)Endliche ModelltheorieGroup actionTransformation (genetics)Utility softwareOpen sourcePhysical systemFood energyArchaeological field surveyProjective planeEvent horizonDigitizingFocus (optics)Incidence algebraMeeting/Interview
02:00
Focus (optics)Projective planeFood energyNatural numberOpen sourcePhysical systemMeeting/Interview
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Alphabet (computer science)Order (biology)Execution unitGradientDependent and independent variablesDivision (mathematics)Decision theoryWater vaporMeeting/Interview
02:58
AreaRule of inferenceService (economics)Vector potentialOpen sourceData managementPlanningAutomatic differentiationMeeting/Interview
03:43
MIDIDigitizingTelecommunicationSoftwareOpen sourceElectric generatorSimilarity (geometry)Right angleFood energyDifferent (Kate Ryan album)Meeting/Interview
04:37
Goodness of fitFood energyTransformation (genetics)Group actionPhysical systemSimilarity (geometry)DigitizingSelf-organizationQuicksortMeeting/Interview
05:33
QuicksortSpacetimeProjective planeOpen sourceCASE <Informatik>Group actionData storage deviceMeeting/Interview
06:40
WordDigitizingMedical imagingSpacetimeChainEntire functionOpen sourceFood energyGradientKey (cryptography)Moment (mathematics)Client (computing)CausalityMeeting/Interview
07:35
Client (computing)1 (number)Food energyChainAbsolute valueECosCoefficient of determinationRight angleMeeting/Interview
08:15
Term (mathematics)QuicksortOpen sourceCASE <Informatik>Shared memoryChainVotingRegulator geneWellenwiderstand <Strömungsmechanik>FamilyPoint (geometry)Virtual machineDifferent (Kate Ryan album)BitNatural numberMereologySoftware developerLatent heatSymbol tableContent (media)CollaborationismCellular automatonMeeting/Interview
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TelecommunicationSoftwareInternet service providerCloud computingHigh availabilityEnterprise architectureOpen sourceDampingRight angleMeeting/Interview
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Open sourceRoundness (object)Food energyWordCASE <Informatik>Digital signal processingTransformation (genetics)Network topologyMeeting/Interview
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Open sourceSource codeQuicksortSoftwareInternetworkingWebsiteTerm (mathematics)Hacker (term)Traffic reportingCodeCASE <Informatik>Open setSoftware developerSignal processingLimit (category theory)Goodness of fitTaylor seriesSimilarity (geometry)Data storage deviceMeeting/Interview
14:33
Open sourceVulnerability (computing)QuicksortConnectivity (graph theory)Service (economics)Computing platformNatural numberPhysical systemElectric generatorGoodness of fitBuildingWave packet2 (number)SoftwareTheory of relativityPrisoner's dilemmaResultantWebsiteTwitterInternet service providerInternetworkingDifferential (mechanical device)Instance (computer science)Single-precision floating-point formatECosFormal languageMeeting/Interview
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Kernel (computing)Point (geometry)Open sourceCartesian coordinate systemExtension (kinesiology)Strategy gameConnectivity (graph theory)QuicksortForcing (mathematics)FreezingAutomatic differentiationFreewareSoftwareDifferential (mechanical device)Reading (process)MereologyMeeting/Interview
17:48
Theory of relativityOpen sourceFood energyFeedbackShift operatorMereologyInternet service providerCycle (graph theory)Address spaceSoftwareComputing platformProjective planeCollaborationismType theoryService (economics)Meeting/Interview
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Projective planeShooting methodInformation securityFood energyPhysical systemGroup actionMeeting/Interview
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Projective planeSoftware developerSpacetimeMeeting/Interview
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Independence (probability theory)Information securityProjective plane2 (number)Pattern recognitionConnectivity (graph theory)Materialization (paranormal)Functional (mathematics)Open sourceDuality (mathematics)Meeting/Interview
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Lattice (order)Data managementNumberAxiom of choiceCodeProjective planeSoftwareOrder (biology)CASE <Informatik>Meeting/Interview
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Open sourceCycle (graph theory)QuicksortFood energyProjective planeSoftware maintenanceLine (geometry)Online helpSoftware developerExpected valueMusical ensembleAxiom of choicePhysical systemMultiplication signECosOpen setCausalityTerm (mathematics)Touch typingLie groupMeeting/Interview
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Open sourceMultiplication sign2 (number)Meeting/Interview
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Complex (psychology)Food energySoftware developerTransformation (genetics)Network topologyOpen sourceMeeting/Interview
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Direction (geometry)Open sourceCASE <Informatik>Point (geometry)Meeting/Interview
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GradientCASE <Informatik>Point (geometry)InfotainmentQuicksortTelematikArithmetic meanElectronic visual displayAngleProjective planeMeeting/Interview
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Projective planePoint (geometry)Basis <Mathematik>QuicksortTerm (mathematics)Metropolitan area networkMeeting/Interview
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Game theoryOpen sourceOnline helpSoftware maintenanceQuicksortTerm (mathematics)MereologySoftware developerProjective planeService (economics)GradientProcess (computing)Metropolitan area networkCondition numberArithmetic meanMessage passingMeeting/Interview
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Group actionMultiplication signEntire functionFood energyFamilyMeeting/Interview
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Food energyOpen sourceControl flowInternet forumSystem programmingPower (physics)Computer networkInternet der DingeComputer animationProgram flowchart
Transcript: English(auto-generated)
00:15
All right, so we're here for the Energy Fosman panel, and I will first introduce myself,
00:23
Ferdi Ponci. Here, I'm a professor for monitoring and distributed control for power systems. I'm with the Institute for Automation of Complex Power Systems, or WTHA, in Germany. So I work on edge solutions, microservice based architectures for measuring, monitoring,
00:44
controlling this energy grid undergoing the transition, so packed with renewables, with the new types of users, with all kinds of energy storage systems. I have collaborated with the Linux Foundation Energy to prepare the survey, the 2022 survey,
01:04
on transformation readiness for the electrical system, and we were targeting utilities to find out how ready they are for the digital transition. Just want to mention that this effort was initiated, was driven by Dr.
01:25
Shuli Goodman, with whom I had the privilege to work and the joy to know, and that will be my forever role model. Okay, so I'm looking forward to hear the experiences from other industries as we're
01:48
concerned with the digital transition. So I would like our panelists to first introduce themselves. So please, Kate, Kate Stewart, you want to start? Sure.
02:00
My name is Kate Stewart. I'm the VP of Dependable Embedded Systems at the Linux Foundation. And so my focus has been, what do we need to do to make open source projects and systems dependable in the embedded system? And obviously, given the energy sector, given the critical nature of it, this is something that's very near and dear to the things I care about.
02:24
Thank you, Kate. Great. So we'll go in first name, alphabetical order now, Daniel. Yes, hi. I'm Dan Koshy. I'm the executive director, responsible for automotive grade Linux. And before that, I was the VP GM of the automotive business unit at a company called
02:45
Monte Vista. And we were the first to put Linux in a car. That was my division. And we were also the first to put Linux in a mobile phone, which was the Motorola Razor mobile phone. So that's kind of my background. Thank you, Dan. Thanks a lot. Gabriele, please.
03:01
Well, first of all, thank you for the opportunity here. I'm Gabriele Colombo. I have two roles. One is general manager for Linux Foundation Europe. This is one of the areas that makes it really interesting for me to be here. So thank you for the opportunity. But the role why I'm here is executive director of Finos, the FinTech open source
03:24
foundation. We really spent the last few years waking up the financial services industry to the benefits of open source. And we're now seeing a lot of potential for this industry to better collaborate in the open. So I'm happy to share my experience here.
03:41
Yeah, wonderful. Thank you. And Rani, please. Yeah, hi. I'm Rani Haibi. I'm the CTO of Networking Edge and Access at the Linux Foundation, where I work with telecommunication industry stakeholders on building the technology required for not
04:01
just the digitization of that industry. But as you know, the telecommunication industry has to almost reinvent itself every 10 years or so with different generations of communication, the 4G, 5G. We're already looking at 6G. And open source plays a large role in accelerating this innovation.
04:20
And I'm sure there are many similarities between the telecommunication industry, which is heavily regulated, and the energy industry, which can be used to learn and figure out how to do things right. Thank you so much. Thank you so much. It all really sounds promising and great.
04:42
Good. So I guess we can get started. And I guess we can all agree that the energy sector is really at the tipping point, and that it requires a transformation for decarbonizing the energy system. And to meet the carbonization goals, the digital transition is a necessary step.
05:08
So each of you works in an industry that has undergone similar transformation before. So based on your experience in your own industry, what should the energy stakeholders keep in
05:22
mind to make this transition as efficient as possible? Would you want to start? Maybe you, Kate? OK. So I think one of the things that's important to keep in mind here as people are trying to transition is these sorts of journeys go better with company.
05:45
And so finding people that you can collaborate with and effectively forming communities will help build up more consensus, get more eyes on the problem, and will accelerate the quality coming into play.
06:02
So I think that is sort of the one probable tip that they should look at. We're seeing lots and lots and lots of innovation happening in the embedded space right now between the wind, the solar, and so forth. And a lot of microgrids and some of the new grid technologies emerging that are using
06:23
the open source technologies. So figuring out, finding projects that you're interested in that are relevant to you, and then starting to collaborate to extend it to make sure it fits for your use case is pretty much why open source tends to work. Thank you so much.
06:41
Anybody who wants to follow up? Maybe, Dan? Yeah, I'll say a few words. So my advice to the energy sector would be to identify like a handful, maybe three to five companies that are key leaders or thought leaders in this space at the moment. And really get them to buy into this digitization and new open source model.
07:07
And I'll use automotive grade Linux, which we also refer to as AGL as an example. So we went with, we identified the top carmakers like Toyota, Mazda, Honda, Hyundai,
07:21
Mercedes, etc. And we got them involved very, very early. And by doing so it caused the entire supply chain underneath them to pay attention. But also it caused them to say, hey, we need to get behind this because our biggest clients are behind it. Right? If Toyota is behind this effort, we need to get behind this effort.
07:41
And together, they form this community, which now we have over 150 companies. And that would be my advice to the energy sector is you need at least the top dogs, you know, the top three to five companies, or at least the thought leaders, the ones that are innovative to buy into what you're trying to do, and really change the way
08:02
the supply chain in the community will be working in the future. That would be my advice. Thank you so much. Very, very direct. Gabriel, do you want to say something? Yeah, absolutely. And I certainly want to echo what Kate and Dan shared.
08:22
You know, it is not lost on me that especially when you're talking about a regulated industry like finance or energy, of course, we hear from telco. You know, it is really hard to change an industry through open source if you don't have, you know, both a broad community, but also a community that really has the
08:43
sort of market leaders and the players. You know, it's not lost on me that Finos wouldn't have experienced this growth if we didn't have sort of the top 10 investment banks in the world really already part of the community from the get go. If I can add something specific to the nature of the industry.
09:03
You know, I come from open source communities. I'm a developer. I've always sort of been very fond of the value of open source in technology, in terms of talent, in terms of collaboration, in terms of the solutions that it can provide. But when you're trying to build a community that is vertical and vertically focused on
09:22
a specific industry, it's really important to hone in on the business value that can be driven out of open source, not just the technology value. That's something that, you know, in my world has meant finding use cases and strategic challenges that are important for this sort of large firms, but not just for those,
09:44
you know, to really involve every constituents in the value chain of that specific industry. In our case means not only the banks, but of course, fintechs, vendors, data and technology vendors that work in their industry, and importantly, regulators.
10:01
And know that that is sometimes an impedance mismatch in terms of their understanding of open source and sometimes the fear of open source. But in the long term is super valuable if you can shift left that engagement to the point that, you know, maybe before my grandkids grow old, they come up with open source
10:21
machine readable regulation themselves. And so that's a little bit of a, you know, a call to involve all the different constituents, of course, with, you know, having sort of the top leaders involved. Thank you so much. Thank you. Thank you. Very interesting.
10:41
And Randy? Yeah, so I think something that I heard in the telecommunication industry that kind of slowed down the adoption of open source was the misconception that the industry is so unique with its requirement for high availability and being regulated that we need to invent
11:04
everything from scratch and all the technology needs to be unique. While in reality, there is some grain of truth to that, but there are some unique requirements. But if you really look at the required technology, I would say 90% of it can be
11:21
reused from other industry, maybe the cloud service providers, maybe even from enterprise. And maybe by using that, only 10% of the software needs to be unique per industry. But there's a lot that can be reused. So there is no need to kind of reinvent the wheel. There's a lot that can be adopted.
11:42
It's so true. Thank you. All right. So now that we had this round of tips from the different industries, maybe we want to go deeper into what is the role of open source specifically in your industry.
12:00
So how did open source impact digital transformation within your industry so that we can make the case for the energy sector as well? Yeah, I can see a few words. So in the case of automotive, it was quite challenging because it wasn't necessarily a technology discussion.
12:21
It was a discussion with lawyers because the automotive industry is very much risk averse. So everything they do is to mitigate risk and liability. And the misconception was that open source was not secure and not safe and that it was a bunch of hackers doing stuff on some website and all these misconceptions.
12:45
We had to go to these automotive companies and teach them that this is not the case. And we used a lot of methods to do this. One of the methods is that Linux Foundation has some very good reports that show that open source is actually more secure.
13:01
There's more eyeballs. There's more developers looking at the source code to make sure that it doesn't have any nefarious intentions or nefarious code. And unlike closed source, where one bad employee could really inject some bad code. And if that employee leaves someday, a lot of bad things can happen.
13:24
And so all these misconceptions, we had to educate the industry. We had to educate specifically the legal departments inside these car companies to make them understand that, no, this is really, really good, high quality software. In fact, this open source software runs most of the internet as we know it.
13:42
And so once they started understanding that and we started explaining to them that it's actually potentially less liability for you. I'll use the Toyota example. If Toyota is using a piece of open source software and Mazda is using it and Mercedes is using it and Volkswagen is using it, they're all using the same piece of software.
14:03
There's a lot more safety in that in terms of they're all using the same code. Their engineers are all looking at the same code and they're all debugging the same code. And when they find an issue, they give it back to the community and everybody benefits. And so once they understood this process and the value of open source,
14:22
then it became easier for them to adopt it. And so that's how we approached it. Thank you, Dan. Very good advice. I was going to jump in and something similar, sort of echoing the last two speakers. Definitely financial services has sort of the special snowflake syndrome that we heard
14:45
from sort of the networking side of the house. I think it's generally related to the fact that sometimes they hide behind their regulated nature to say, there's just things that we cannot do. But the reality is, once you dig in, there's nothing preventing them from doing open source.
15:02
I think one of the ways open source has changed the industry is making them realize more and more that 80 to 90% of what they do is non-differentiating. And it's just a waste of resources. When if you think about it, this industry is really now heavily competing with big tech
15:21
and the West Coast really aggressively entering the financial market. And so really sort of this push to be more efficient found a really good solution in open source. I think the second sort of related topic that I think is really changing the industry is the talent aspect.
15:41
Sort of 10 years ago, most of these banks, there's plenty of articles talking about Goldman Sachs or JP Morgan as to how they had internal even programming languages. They went to the very bottom layer of the stack and building everything proprietary and everything customized. And maybe 10 years ago, that was considered the secret sauce for them.
16:03
If you fast forward five to seven years, in the last three years, there's been a clear realization that actually that's a weight. That is actually something that can become a weakness because it's really hard to hire talent
16:20
that then you need to train up on your internal platform versus for example, JP Morgan using the Python ecosystem that every single day builds new components and new talent. And so I think besides the differentiation, I think open source is really creating a whole new generation of talent that hopefully is going to result in a better financial system
16:44
across the world. Thanks a lot, a bunch of critical topic, talent and training. Yeah, if I could, I'd like to sort of build on what Dan and Gabrielle are saying.
17:00
Open source tends to be sort of the base of innovation, and there are components out there that are used widely beyond across all of our sectors. For instance, I think you'll see the Linux kernel for one of them is in a lot of these places already. I think it's in something like 70% of all embedded applications that are already running Linux.
17:21
And so we've got that innovation there. And if you can leverage what is out there already to the points we just made and focus on the value add and your differentiation, it's a much more efficient strategy and quite frankly, de-risks things to a large extent.
17:45
Renny, what's your perspective? Yeah, to add to everything that's already been said, I think when people, some people think about FOSS, they think about the free as in free beer that it's a cheap and inferior software. But in reality, it's more about the free as in free spirit where everybody can take
18:03
part in creating the technology. And I think Gabrielle kind of alluded to that shift left where actually the consumers of technology can work side to side or shoulder to shoulder with the creators of the technology. And that leads to much shorter cycles of innovation. So it really opens up a new way for, let's say, the energy providers to work with their
18:25
vendors and to kind of have a short feedback loop for what their requirements are and what their needs are and making sure that the software developed really addresses their needs. So open source communities and open source projects provide this platform for this type
18:40
of collaboration. Thank you so much. Yes, relation with the customer is key right now in the energy sector, of course. So well, I guess that after looking at the strengths, we can look at the potential pitfalls. So for what pitfalls should stakeholders look out for the transition process?
19:09
Maybe I can start here. You know, I care about some of these things pretty tightly. I think first off is security, making sure that the projects you're using are based
19:20
are sustainable. Our sustainable projects have well done. You know, have it's not just a single developer. It's going to base something on something. Make sure that you know you have some diversity of community behind it. But that, quite frankly, also the community is paying attention to security. And practices in that space.
19:42
So focusing on making sure you understand the security story of the projects you tend to incorporate. The open source project you want to incorporate is first would be the first recommendation. Second recommendation is knowing exactly which projects you're bringing in, because a lot of these projects will bring in dependencies. And so technologies like software, dual materials or s-bombs and having a clear line of sight
20:04
as to all of the components you've brought in and the implicit dependencies as a function of security, but it's also a function of safety. Because you cannot go through any safety or regulatory things without knowing in detail exactly which pieces you're bringing in. So the transparency and being, so one, the projects you're bringing in, make sure that
20:24
you've got a sustainable ecosystem behind them and they pay attention to security. And then two, know all the dependencies that they're bringing in. Thank you, Kate. Do we want to go? Yeah, I think this may sound strange, but I think one of the pitfalls is that companies
20:45
want to form a consortium and they're all really eager to do it. They're all, oh my God, let's do this. This is great. And then there's no funding. And that's the biggest pitfall in my opinion. You have to fund these projects because these projects don't run themselves.
21:01
And so you can't, the software is free and it's open and you can go download it. Sure. But the project itself, in order to build a community that needs at least some decent amount of funding. And a lot of companies don't realize that. And they think they can throw a few thousand dollars at it and it's going to be fine.
21:21
But I think raising funds to run the project and to build the community, have a community management in place and have events, things like all member meetings. These things are quite important to build a community in my opinion. And then number two, I would say if you're going to be creating original code for the
21:41
project, the choice of license is quite important. In most cases, you have to pick a very business friendly license. Otherwise, the adoption of the code will be really bad. And so there's a lot of precedence in what license to pick. So I don't think it's very difficult, but you have to make sure it's a business friendly
22:02
license for the members. I just want to sort of connect, I think what the last three folks said. I've heard so many times, especially early in the days, this idea of, yeah, let's put this project out there and then the community will come.
22:22
And the reality is that it's not as easy. And besides, of course, considering foundations as a help to grow your project, sort of shameless plug here. But I want to hit on something that Randy said.
22:41
When you put out an open source project, either solo or in a foundation, you always want to consider how is it going to create an actual ecosystem and an actual potentially commercially viable ecosystem? Because ultimately, we all know that open source is free as in free spirit.
23:01
But there is a lot of really valuable sort of virtuous cycle that can be built around an open source project with then the idea of increasing the sustainability of that project, both in terms of reinvestments, touching on the funding that Dan mentioned, and on the sustainability of the maintainers that Kate touched upon.
23:21
So I think it's really important to when you think about an open source project, how you draw those sort of bright lines and maintain expectations that are both fulfilling the need of individual developers in the community and are aligned with the ethos of open source. But ultimately, again, touching also on the license choice, don't undermine the potential
23:44
creation of a commercial ecosystem around that project, which ultimately is going to be what fuels the sustainability of the project in the long run. And I admit this is more an art than science still, but it's something that I think it's becoming mainstream more and more.
24:02
And I think it's important that the energy sector thinks about this as well. Yeah, and I would like to summarize maybe saying don't try to do too much open source and it may sound crazy because we're advocating here for open source, but I've seen some companies trying to do too much open source at once and then diluting the resources, not
24:26
having the funding, not having the personnel. So I think my advice would be identify where it makes sense the most to start with open source, start there and then grow your open source involvement as you go. You don't need to go from zero to 60 in three seconds.
24:42
It could be more gradual. It makes sense to make it more gradual, learn from from your experience and then expand more into open source over time. So, well, I guess when when developers and industries in the energy sector try to
25:04
undertake this transformation, they may find it intimidating. The complexity of it may be intimidating. So what is your advice to those who have to undertake this journey in the energy sector
25:21
for decarbonizing the energy system? So I would maybe start again, tying to my last comment, start small. Yes, open source can be intimidating. Things can go in the wrong direction real fast if you don't do it right.
25:40
So it's really important to identify where it makes sense the most to start and start with something small and then build up on that. Yeah, I agree with that. You need to identify maybe the biggest pain point, maybe the top two or three things
26:03
that companies are dealing with and struggling with and start chipping away at those things. You know, in the case of automotive grade Linux, we first tackled infotainment because this was the biggest pain point for the carmakers. They were not keeping up with the mobile phone.
26:21
But then eventually we went on to support instrument cluster, heads up display, telematics. So now we support all sorts of things in the vehicle. But we started with the most important one, which was the biggest pain point for our members and for our community. So I would be that would be my advice is pick one to start with and go with that.
26:41
And you'll grow on that success eventually. I'll also say taking sort of the angle of go out and be in the community, find projects related to the things that you care about and have people sitting there and volunteering to do things so that you're seen as active in the community and you are contributing back.
27:01
And then as you start to find the people that care about the same problems as you, you have a basis to serve, build from. But you also know the behaviors of the community. And you know, the points to watch out for us have been alluded to already. I mean, you mentioned both sort of corporate and individuals here, and I think I couldn't agree more on the corporate side in terms of starting small,
27:24
finding, you know, high value challenges. And of course, ideally seeding the solution with an initial contribution or a project that is already out there that can be augmented. I also do think, you know, we take a lot of pride in trying to engage individual developers
27:43
and showing the value of the work that we're doing in our community, financial service to individual, whether that means, you know, incentivizing an award, whether it means getting sort of your next big job in a large financial institution.
28:00
I hear a lot of talks of, you know, I realize that some of our communities being very professional grade can be, you know, considered daunting for an individual that, you know, maybe comes out of school and wants to engage in open source. But the reality is that on the other side, there's always a maintainer that is in need of help. And so when I feel, you know, a lot of, you know, imposter syndrome,
28:26
I think my best suggestion, again, for individual, we talked about a lot of corporates, but for individuals, even if you're, you know, engaging in a potentially very complex project, very sort of highly professional open source project, just understand that on the other hand, there's always someone in need of help.
28:43
And so that, you know, doing your due diligence, reading the manual, reading the documentation, complying with the contribution guidelines is important. But, you know, don't be scared, take the leap. It's almost like, you know, when you're jumping off a cliff, just the jumping part is hard after that, you know, you're on your way.
29:04
Thank you so much. This was great. We got advice for the entire sector and down to the individuals. So thank you very much. So I think our time is up. I want to thank the panelists very, for a very,
29:24
very interesting discussion and for energizing me and hopefully the entire energy sector towards this transition. Thank you all and have a nice evening.