NetBSD - A modern operating system for your retro battlestation

Video thumbnail (Frame 0) Video thumbnail (Frame 4141) Video thumbnail (Frame 14469) Video thumbnail (Frame 16768) Video thumbnail (Frame 19307) Video thumbnail (Frame 31395) Video thumbnail (Frame 35595) Video thumbnail (Frame 39134)
Video in TIB AV-Portal: NetBSD - A modern operating system for your retro battlestation

Formal Metadata

NetBSD - A modern operating system for your retro battlestation
Title of Series
CC Attribution 2.0 Belgium:
You are free to use, adapt and copy, distribute and transmit the work or content in adapted or unchanged form for any legal purpose as long as the work is attributed to the author in the manner specified by the author or licensor.
Release Date

Content Metadata

Subject Area
Arm Inheritance (object-oriented programming) Code SPARC Projective plane Range (statistics) 32-bit Neuroinformatik Befehlsprozessor Software Integrated development environment Different (Kate Ryan album) Finite difference Time evolution Software Computer network Computer hardware Software testing Whiteboard Family Physical system Physical system Asynchronous Transfer Mode Alpha (investment)
Polar coordinate system Group action Code Multiplication sign Execution unit Workstation <Musikinstrument> Floppy disk PowerPC Mereology 32-bit Neuroinformatik Atari ST Emulator Different (Kate Ryan album) Befehlsprozessor Computer network Cuboid Cloning Physical system Compact space Software developer PC Card Moment (mathematics) Bit Flow separation Angle Whiteboard Geometry Laptop Web page Slide rule Image resolution Real number Adaptive behavior Flash memory Virtual machine Process capability index Laser Coprocessor Internetworking Computer hardware Form factor (electronics) Address space Modem Domain name Projective plane Memory management Plastikkarte Basis <Mathematik> Mathematics Personal digital assistant File archiver Video game Musical ensemble
Building Code Multiplication sign Source code Workstation <Musikinstrument> Decimal Compiler Open set PowerPC Arm Neuroinformatik Medical imaging Emulator Single-precision floating-point format Computer network Cuboid Software framework Information security Physical system Source code Simulation Arm Electric generator Decimal Building Structural load Software developer Electronic mailing list Bit Instance (computer science) Mikroarchitektur Process (computing) Befehlsprozessor Linker (computing) Website Whiteboard Alpha (investment) Resultant Arc (geometry) Booting Laptop Point (geometry) Slide rule Beat (acoustics) Inheritance (object-oriented programming) Open source Virtual machine Device driver Process capability index Student's t-test Product (business) Revision control Prototype Linear programming Computer hardware Software testing Gamma function Form factor (electronics) Booting Traffic reporting Firmware Computing platform Alpha (investment) Turbo-Code Graphics processing unit Execution unit Inheritance (object-oriented programming) Projective plane Content (media) Plastikkarte Compiler Uniform resource locator Visualization (computer graphics) Motherboard Personal digital assistant Data acquisition Cube Video game Table (information) Fingerprint Window Operating system
Pulse (signal processing) Building Workstation <Musikinstrument> Adaptive behavior Virtual machine Compiler Process capability index Mereology Neuroinformatik Mathematics Different (Kate Ryan album) Computer hardware Operating system Bus (computing) Software testing Process (computing) Form factor (electronics) Äquivalenzprinzip <Physik> Physical system Dependent and independent variables Building Software developer PC Card Projective plane Plastikkarte Bit Compiler Process (computing) Software Personal digital assistant
Service (economics) Collaborationism
okay all right thank you for coming
everyone my name is seven I'm going to give you a talk about the net BST project and how it might be of interest to you if you have a lot of old hardware around and you want to do something with modern software so quick intro about why you might want to do this you might have a lot of old hardware and we have different operating systems and if you want to test something across your different systems this provides you a consistent environment regardless of the hardware that you want to try gives you the opportunity to kind of test an idea across the board from something as old as a VAX to something more modern today PDA running on an arm CPU and it depends on how patched and passionate you are about your ideas but it could be a good way of actually measuring how your code performs in such situations and like I said the software benefits from the exercise so say the Sun SPARC CPUs have very kind of strict alignment requirements so which you don't necessarily have say on a on a PC so while things kind of work okay on your on your desktop computer you might find that when you're actually trying to run on these systems things blow up spectacularly and that just kind of feeds back into your software and makes it more robust if not fun yeah so this is the range of systems that the net BST project supports broken down from different families of CPUs starting from the dec alpha to the families of armed that's strongarm Dex kale and the more modern variants that you find the hppa Intel the Motorola family big-endian and little-endian MIPS PowerPC Hitachi super H in big endian mode and little endian mode 32-bit spark 64-bit spark VAX and that doesn't matter
so a moment of silence for the Acorn 26-bit port which died earlier last month it died of severe bit rot basically but it was an interesting system because it's a 32-bit processor but with a 26 bit address space so that kind of gives it an interesting angle because traditionally for UNIX you're expecting a 32-bit system with memory management unit as your kind of requirement but due to the lack of these systems are kind of quite rare and really they pretty much lived on in educational establishments in the UK so it's quite rare to kind of get that in the hands of developers outside so that's gone to the CVS attic now does anyone know what this is there's something about black obelisk obelisks right so this is a computer made by Sharpe and sold in Japan in the late 80s and I think early 90s it's on the similar idea as like the Neo Geo which was bringing the arcade experience to the home and this is a Motorola I think like six 802 Oh were the original systems and it went up to like six eight oh three oh and this is very popular in Japan and if you're lucky you may get it get your hands on it some in the other parts of the world but it's very rare we happily run on these systems and there's a big group of Japanese developers who actively make sure that things run okay on this if you're not fortunate enough to kind of get your hands on one of these systems you can get your hands on an emulator called X m6i which as I was preparing my slides for I realized that they I don't know if someone's let the domain slip so it's actually being squatted but if you look on the Internet Archive XM six-eyed org you can get a copy of the emulator and so people typically run this on Raspberry Pi and emulate one of these systems [Music] and what he's still going to take a Dreamcast yeah so we've the support for this has been there for quite a while problem with this is as we've liked most of these old computers as the previous speaker said the hardware ends up becoming very pricey to obtain so we required a broadband adapter which in reality is just you know there are cheaper real tech network cards it's just one of those in a bespoke form factor but you can expect to pay up to like 400 pounds on eBay for one of these so there's various projects for like kind of doing DIY DIY broadband adapters based on you know just a standard PCI actually it might be I sir 10 megabit network card that you put into a breadboard and just wire it in directly to your Dreamcast it's not as tidy but it's a lot cheaper than 400 quid and I was always kind of looking trying to prepare the slides for this there's actually a troll page that I found which was basically somebody saying that if you grease your modem ports and that wedged the ethernet cable in you might be able to get it working if your systems aligned correctly with your PC and with most of these systems which you know quite old as age moved forward certain things kind of start to manifest you know so like the lasers in this case the laser for the drive wasn't really built to last you know 15 20 years so one of the common things again looking on eBay is there's usually you can pick these machines up without to working as a GD Drive said there's various projects arounds as well so you can actually just use a compact flash adapter and continue to kind of operate your Dreamcast machine starts to look as these kind of projects and things pile up to your shiny nice case kind of starts to lose its niceness because you just kind of gross tentacles and wires and stuff another one does anyone know what this machine is from Japan so this is the Homer on Luna workstation this is a this one is a 68040 based system this was built by a corporation in Japan in the late 80s and the significance of this machine is is that at the time when it came out it had CPM support it had mark support and it had support for four three bsd out of the box like natively so with one of these you can test your code all the way back to 43 bsd and up to modern-day net bsd and later on just before the company imploded they also did a workstation on the motorola 88 k which was the processor between the 68000 and the PowerPC which didn't really take on we don't support the 68k 88 k machines i think so yes more importantly as the resolution that said like oh yeah I mean like even my laptop here extremely thing they've kind of given through that yeah so but the OpenBSD guys basically took our 68,000 port and used it as the basis for the 88 thousand port and these machines are interested in as well and that's you can replace the floppy drive with a PCMCIA adapter and then you can you know get it on Wi-Fi and Brow's maybe actually this is fresh
effort going on at the moment actually does anyone know what this board is so this is a milan board which according to wikipedia was built by a company in germany towards the end of the 90s and was produced until like the early 2000s and this is a an Atari ST clone but the difference being that it's got PCI slots icer as well and they can support up to 512 megabytes of RAM interesting thing is is that it's actually got an Intel Triton chipset which Intel did for the PCs back in the day the support for this actually landed quite some time ago but what I was saying about assumptions somebody assumed that you would only ever find an Intel Triton chipset on an x86 machine and basically ripped out the support for that in the atari port and broke things but one of the zoomy satsui has been kind of working on this at the moment because he's just been donated aboard and the system's sprung back into life is quite impressive actually going back according to wikipedia actually
there was a also a an ACP so this is the old-fashioned 80 style motherboards they actually did prototype a CPI version but it actually never made it to production and that would have been quite cool today amiga we support there we go but on the earlier systems you need something basically with an MMU so that means that you're confined to a six eight oh three o or up we support the six eight oh six o as well which is supposed to be kind of compatible with the six eight oh four Oh there's a couple of things that don't behave the same as but it's there and as the previous speaker said you can expect to pay lots of money for one of these accelerator boards to get things going and will you remember cobalt so cobalt was a company that came around I think in the late 90s and the idea was to kind of build an appliance for serving content and it was kind of complemented with a extremely outdated version of Linux even for the time and we run on those as well so these appliances are typically MIPS 4000 based systems and you can get them in various form factors they're commonly like kind of a rackmount based system but you can also get this really nice cube that kind of sits in your shelf nicely and has a single PCI slots Windows CE PDAs so we
have the the actual window c-d-c project went through like three generations of CPU architecture the original stuff was based on MIPS and then it moved on to the Hitachi super H and then after that it kind of died with arm and the arm stuff is super strongarm initially and XScale afterwards and we we're pretty much support those the nice thing is is actually again for the from Japan you can get these really nice I think they're sharp on mobile phones which run the Excel XScale CPU and you can run net bsd on them as well yeah if you were if you besides the richer computing if you actually want to do like the build the bootloader or anything like that you have to get into a bit of embedded Visual C++ which its own a style of madness cool so we need to kind of make sure that some of this stuff actually works and not it's just not theoretical so there's a project called Anita which is this Python based framework and it basically spins up an instance of whatever machine has been configured to boot net bsd iso runs through the install process and I guess run some tests as well runs the test framework and then you know publishes the results for the Google of Summer of Code last year there was a project to form from one of the students to extend the support so I think support for the P max our report was added there HPC mips the mips-based PDP das was added and there was a third one but I can't remember but I will show you on the next slide we basically have support for emulators so these can be wired into Anita so Kim you for doing like spark PowerPC and things like that sim h4 VAX does everyone know what's mh's yes soot from your talk last year that was excellent the gentleman gave a talk about trying to boot net bsd VAX and testing for practice in Postgres so sim ejection East arted life in Dec in the 60s for basically testing the PDP hardware and it kind of evolved from there and at some point it was open sourced to the world and so you can use that to boot annette bsd but you can also use it to kind of boots loads of other interesting old operating systems like from deck and thing like that GXE meal is an interesting emulator it does kind of MIPS it does the Dreamcast like super H stuff I mean some other platforms UAE is the unsupported or no unbootable amigo emulator but then once they got the Amiga beating they changed it to unix amiga or emulator and the XM CI is the 68000 arcade machine emulator that i was mentioning earlier on yeah and so that's the Japanese guys like most of the conference's have like a Raspberry Pi booting the emulator and that's I think like a PI one or a PI T with X running an FPS two complementary hardware so that's a new graphics card that came out I think last year which supports net bsd amiga the developer actually worked that the creator of this actually worked with one of the net bsd developers to put driver together so that was cool so things are still going on he's currently actually working on a new laptop project called the reform this kind of open source secure one not secure table open hardware laptop that you may have heard of last year for your VAX and other turbo channel based on hardware we can bring you the wonders of USB so you can you might laugh but you might want to get on Wi-Fi with your back station running that VSD you're not going to get a turbo channel based Wi-Fi adapter [Laughter] so that's the turbo channel is Buster's found on deck hardware so the facts one generation of the Alpha and the mips-based deck stations and that's a one of the net bsd devs who created this his new project that was i think last year or the year before that he was doing this does anyone know what a deck Dennard is okay that from the net VST devs in the room so deck denied was the reference strongarm hardware platform that was created by deck in late 90s yeah so it's an open firmware based strongarm system and on the board you have this kind of connector and based on this connector is actually a PCI slot so he's built an adapter that plugs into this and then with that you get PCI so you can plug in modern hardware into your ancient strong-arm appliance I won't actually post the picture but I couldn't get on to his website it is that the URL is correct that there's some problem yeah so why would you want to do this it's really easy to kind of get started excuse the slides I had this kind of weird problem but really all you need is a copy of the source code before it's a kind of experiment and build stuff but otherwise you know I just grabbed a knife so and get started but if you wanted to kind of build the OS obtain the source code if you run the build SH list arc you'll get the list of architectures that you can just build out of the box right there so if you wanted to kind of target the next station you would say you want the tools and that would just go through and build Lin card compiler and everything else that you need to kind of build the OS and then for the last one you can say build the release and it would go through everything build all the kernels and generate an image for you ready to play with but you don't have to go through this process you could just download an ISO from the website and start playing
retro blues sadness most modern wet Wi-Fi adapters that can do WPA a card buffs and that means the difference between card bus and PCMCIA though they're the same form factor PCMCIA is basically a nicer card in a credit card size form factor whereas card buses pci and most of these ancient pieces of hardware only do the PCMCIA so it means that you're confined to an adapter that's can only do 802 11 B and without onion WEP so that kind of sucks for the PDAs for example so you might have a like a modern operating system that can do like ipv6 on your back station it's another problem when you actually want to get some software on that because the way that Perl 5 does its build process means that it's not possible to actually cross compile that so basically what happens is the official documented processes that you would have a your target Hardware sitting there and on your shiny fast computer you would invoke to build but the build would kind of SSH one to your target do all its tests and then continue building on it which you can't really automate and you can't kind of fake that under on your modern machine so it means you'd be surprised how how much you can't build if you don't have them version of par five and it's going to be interesting if ever there ever is going to be a move to pulse six permanently because there's a lot of stuff that just won't work I guess I'm not actually delved into there actually and that's exactly the part of the approach that the FreeBSD project has taken for the modern systems but the thing is is actually for us we actually have the cross-compilation support for cross building packages it's just that we completely fall short at the Perl process because of this requirement any other questions yes so the question
was there's a note about of c9 c99 compiler on most of these machines pre 99 yes this is if you want to kind of cross compile from another computer if you're actually installing a release you would actually get a modern compiler with it so I'm assuming that you want to experiment like you want to change something about the OS and yeah so the question was about to change support for legacy systems and bit rot and issues that crop up yes and actually this is a problem with some of the legacy systems because as support gets removed from GCC upstream you're kind of in this limbo the nice thing is is one of our developers jörg is actively working on LLVM support and then in response to some of support for some of these architectures they've been quite welcoming in terms of yeah sure we can have that I think this specific case was the 68,000 motorola support that they were happy to kind of take on I'm not sure what to get what it means for the back support but Olivia yeah so apparently we've also received GCC and GCC fixes for MIPS and fax support from the audience that's it thank you for listening [Applause]