The Politics of Privacy and Technology: Fighting an Uphill Battle

Video in TIB AV-Portal: The Politics of Privacy and Technology: Fighting an Uphill Battle

Formal Metadata

Title
The Politics of Privacy and Technology: Fighting an Uphill Battle
Title of Series
Author
License
CC Attribution 3.0 Unported:
You are free to use, adapt and copy, distribute and transmit the work or content in adapted or unchanged form for any legal purpose as long as the work is attributed to the author in the manner specified by the author or licensor.
Identifiers
Publisher
Release Date
2013
Language
English

Content Metadata

Subject Area
Abstract
In the past few decades the world has been dramatically transformed by technology. People have significantly evolved in how they interact with each other and the world; a side effect of this evolution is the drastic change in personal privacy. Private citizens, corporations, and governments all have different ideas on what privacy means and what information should be respected as private. Typically citizens don't realize their expectations of privacy are falsely held, or more accurately that they have very little privacy left. Regarding privacy, decades have gone by without any action to protect an individual's privacy against entities buying, selling, storing, and using your private data. Policy can take years to enact, and the minimal legislative action happening leans toward protecting special interest groups who have great political sway. Action needs to be taken. Policy needs to be created allowing businesses to operate while allowing individuals to keep their information private. In the 2013 Montana Legislative Session Daniel Zolnikov, with the support of Eric Fulton, worked to introduce comprehensive legislation to protect the privacy of the citizens of Montana. Daniel Zolnikov and Eric Fulton will talk about the ideas behind the bill, the process of drafting and introducing legislation, presenting the bill before committee and the public testimony process, and the politics of why the bill ultimately died. The speakers will end the talk with lessons learned and thoughts on how to effectively pass future privacy legislation. Eric Fulton (@Trisk3t) is a specialist in information security research and network penetration testing who regularly speaks on his research and work. In his spare time, Eric works with local students to provide hands-on security training, conducts independent security research on interesting projects, and occasionally works on legislation affecting privacy and technology. Eric currently works for SubSector Solutions which provides information security services and training. Daniel Zolnikov (@DanielZolnikov) is a State Representative for Montana. As a 26 year old Representative, Daniel is one of the few legislators who even remotely understands the threats and concerns of the collection of personal information. He spent his first session working to fill a policy vacuum where privacy and politics meet the road. Daniel sponsored multiple bills, including two pieces of privacy legislation. The first bill would have created the Montana Privacy Act. The second bill, which was signed into law, prevented law enforcement from obtaining cell phone location information without a warrant. For the sake of transparency, he uses his Facebook page www.facebook.com/danielzolnikov to post his votes. Daniel received his undergraduate degree from the University of Montana where he earned 3 business majors in Information Systems, Marketing and Management. As a Montanan, Daniel enjoys the finer things in life including shooting guns, fishing, and fighting tyranny.
Loading...
State of matter Multiplication sign Limit (category theory) Information privacy Total S.A. Sampling (statistics) Twitter Wave packet Goodness of fit Computer cluster Term (mathematics) Hacker (term) Internetworking Information Endliche Modelltheorie Office suite Information security Physical system Area Scaling (geometry) Information Information technology consulting Planning Bit Term (mathematics) Limit (category theory) Information privacy Radius Speech synthesis Right angle Game theory Information security
Web page Greatest element System call State of matter Multiplication sign Covering space Cellular automaton Information privacy Entire function Demoscene Event horizon Data model Spring (hydrology) Order (biology) Centralizer and normalizer Goodness of fit Term (mathematics) Physical law Information Endliche Modelltheorie Addition Touchscreen Information Cellular automaton Web page Physical law State of matter Bit Term (mathematics) System call Video game Information privacy Connected space Arithmetic mean Uniform resource locator Process (computing) Personal digital assistant Video game Speech synthesis Right angle Figurate number
Point (geometry) Drag (physics) State of matter Real number Cellular automaton 1 (number) Sheaf (mathematics) Insertion loss Parameter (computer programming) Information privacy Mereology Goodness of fit Different (Kate Ryan album) Average Authorization Cuboid Physical law Software framework Information Endliche Modelltheorie Information security Traffic reporting Information Regulator gene Weight Chemical equation Physical law Bit Information privacy Voting Sheaf (mathematics) Software framework Right angle Information security Window Row (database)
Point (geometry) Purchasing Game controller Presentation of a group Group action Context awareness Building Service (economics) State of matter Multiplication sign 1 (number) Sheaf (mathematics) Black box Information privacy Vector potential IP address Number Formal language Representation (politics) Information Process (computing) Traffic reporting Identifiability Address space Form (programming) Identity management Self-organization Information Inheritance (object-oriented programming) Point (geometry) Physical law Plastikkarte Bit Database transaction System call Entire function Information privacy Discounts and allowances Type theory Process (computing) Personal digital assistant Sheaf (mathematics) Self-organization Right angle Procedural programming
Suite (music) Group action 1 (number) Mereology Information privacy Formal language Different (Kate Ryan album) Cuboid Conservation law Row (database) Software framework Information Process (computing) Data conversion Extension (kinesiology) Point (geometry) Web page Electronic mailing list Determinism Bit Database transaction Product (business) Electronic signature Data mining Process (computing) Website Right angle Physical system Point (geometry) Web page Service (economics) Perfect group Wage labour Online help Data storage device Product (business) Spreadsheet Telecommunication Term (mathematics) Representation (politics) Address space Game controller Focus (optics) Information Wage labour Projective plane Physical law Planning Plastikkarte Information privacy Uniform resource locator Integrated development environment Sheaf (mathematics) Local ring
Group action Context awareness State of matter Code Multiplication sign View (database) 1 (number) Information privacy Disk read-and-write head Facebook Roundness (object) Physical law Information Process (computing) Data conversion Social class Area Email Electric generator Regulator gene Block (periodic table) Web page Computer Bit Lattice (order) Type theory Process (computing) Self-organization Right angle Smartphone Resultant Row (database) Associative property Point (geometry) Web page Wage labour Online help Login Computer Code Goodness of fit Representation (politics) Associative property Standard deviation Multiplication Information Chemical equation Prisoner's dilemma Physical law Line (geometry) Information privacy Voting Password Formal grammar Speech synthesis Video game Game theory
Web page Point (geometry) Group action Freeware State of matter View (database) Multiplication sign System administrator Source code 1 (number) Branch (computer science) Black box Mereology Information privacy Theory Metadata Power (physics) Data model Strategy game Different (Kate Ryan album) Representation (politics) Endliche Modelltheorie Extension (kinesiology) Logic gate Metropolitan area network Source code Information Chemical equation Physical law State of matter Metadata Bit Line (geometry) Port scanner Limit (category theory) System call Information privacy Type theory Testbed Process (computing) Voting Personal digital assistant Telecommunication Sheaf (mathematics) Boom (sailing) Order (biology) Self-organization Right angle
welcome to the politics of privacy & Technology fighting an uphill battle it's going to be an exciting time we've got a lot to talk about and I'm going to kick it off with a little bit introduction so we're going to talk about what we're gonna do so I'm gonna hand it over to Dan all right my name is Daniel silikov on I am a representative out of the state of Montana so I serve in the state of Montana and Helena I do not yeah I'm a politician so I don't really expect that yet until you figure out what we're trying to do uh so yeah we'll see let's see really quick just the basics of why I ran for office I ran because I don't like what's happening in politics everybody runs for that until they realize how the game works well I didn't like how the game works as well so you'll see how I stood up to some of those interests and uh and what we tried to do on behalf of people not special interests one little nice side note is that I still have a blackberry so hopefully it's like the one thing that won't be hacked during this entire conference you canna has them yeah you can follow me on twitter at daniel's only called last little quick notice i'm originally from a town called roundup montana 2,000 people and like a 30-mile radius this is a this is probably about the whole size of my town in this room right now all right about myself I am NOT a politician but I hang out with them thank you I'm done I'm a hacker I break things just like you guys I run a security consulting firm in Bozeman Montana I know you guys are thinking what do you hack out there I get on the plane a lot and it's the internet I can do it for my pajamas so we have a lot of fun it's great be able to ski and adventure and hang out and then go home and you know hack hospitals and stuff so it's a good time I'd venture a lot I tweet under sub-sector Corp I get to do a little bit of public policy as with this speech working with dan helping people out doing a little bit little bit of training and a little bit of speaking so we're going to kind of just jump right into this what do we want to talk about so we did a lot dad and I are here to talk to you about a little bit about information and politics in Montana and for all of you you might be going up Montana just another state but Montana is good in that it models and represents what a lot of other state legislators do maybe on a little bit of a smaller scale but everything that we talked about today is just as applicable for the states that you live it maybe not for all of you that live overseas hopefully you live in democratic nations but in America you know it's broken down to the state system and Montana is very representative all the other states so everything we do here can be replicated we're gonna talk about privacy legislation what we did what we got to be passed we did Daniel here was able to get some privacy legislation passed to make sure your cell phones are safe yeah but we tried so so much more and that did not pass but we realized what we need to do to get privacy legislation passed in Montana so we're gonna talk about that and our future goals okay so really quick i'm going to talk about Montana in Montana's legislature kind of like what Eric spoke about prior if we get something passed in Montana we're not talking about just what we get them on TANF or Montanans it then is shown to the rest of the state to get passed in other states on behalf of you i mean i don't really rely on the feds for making good policies anymore so I think states rights are big when we can do it in Montana we can do it anywhere the size of Montana is comparable to the size of Germany in an area the population though is about a million people so we have a lot more cows than people legislature serves 90 days every two years so if you want to talk about limited government for months every two years that is not too much and we also have term limits I conserve four terms in the house and four terms in the Senate and then be termed out that is very limited there's not a lot of a lot of new there's always new politicians in there and the majority of the house in the Senate is Republican the governor is Democrat this is extremely important to know I really don't care anybody's political affiliations right now it's the fact that you have to work through both sides to get legislation passed and that's that's we're going to discuss as well really quick let's see if that shows up
this is a quick little screen shot of where Montana is for those of you who don't know the border bummers k hey hey Las Vegas is the bottom left-hand corner fun little side note is that we drove from Montana to Las Vegas and 15 hours so there are other accomplishment so we're going to prep this kind of about what we wanted to do and give you a backstory for the whole situation so right now how many people know about prism and it's a rampant violation of your rights everybody right it's bad okay and so everything thank you everything that we did was before that so think of yourself six months ago and go did I care too much about privacy for some of you maybe this is def con right were the more heightened and more aware of privacy issues but six months ago a lot of people were just like I trust my government and so it's a whole different mindset before that until now with the recent revelations where they go maybe I shouldn't Daniel was his first term as the legislature he was a freshman which is a feat and of itself for getting the bill passed because there's so much that these guys have to learn figure out and basically navigate the jungle of politics in addition to everything else so is his first time doing that heat you know you hadn't built the connections hand figure out the process next time is going to be way spectacular nothing we didn't accomplish a lot and then myself i worked with dan doing a little bit of research working with him bringing the privacy idea of kind of to life so that's that's where we're coming from so what we want to talk about why is there a need for privacy laws like i said earlier uh six months ago a lot of people don't necessarily know why we needed these privacy laws we want to create legislation to enforce montana's constitutional right to privacy and that's important not every state has a constitutional right to privacy so we're lucky that we have kind of something that we can base all of our laws off of its enumerated in the Constitution so we can say look we're just doing what the Constitution says and I'm gonna read it out because it's very important article ten of the Montana Constitution states the right of privacy the right of individual privacy is essential to the well-being of a free society and shall not be infringed without the showing of a compelling state interest awesome right this was written by a bunch of guys who didn't even have you know technology and they were thinking about privacy when our Constitution was implemented it's important it's in central and our rights and liberties don't necessarily have a meaning if we don't have clear laws that protect them we have a constitutional right to privacy but if we don't have that enumerated in individual laws then we don't have citizens don't have the tools necessary to enforce that all right so
HP 60 3 is the privacy bill that actually got past our speech though is not about saying good job to ourselves we got a bill passed it's about the one that failed still I'm going to touch on this first this is cell phone privacy requiring law enforcement to obtain a search warrant before being able to collect location information from electronic devices this was not considered a big deal at the time because the NSA event had not occurred yet I this was a very short and simple bill it was one page long it had emergency opt-outs like in case you need to respond to a 911 call or a life-threatening situation so it was a pretty balanced bill that I had I worked with both sides I listened to both sides i'm talking about Republicans Democrats to get it passed and it was considered a common-sense bill a lot of people I spoke to afterwards is like wasn't that already in law no no there's no policy on privacy really especially with cell phones things like that this has passed and has since been considered model legislation and we originally got the idea from another state that failed to pass it we gotta pass first one in the country now other states are passing it and that that actually makes you feel pretty go to Montana who meets once every two years is in the lead on some of this stuff uh hey you there you so here's just a few headlines covering that bill across the United States and I it's amazing how how much press this is received and I'm really happy for it Montana leads the way in New Age privacy rights Montana anti spy in law good morn eded Montana with Montana's lead states may demand warrants for cell phone data if you don't want the government to spy on spy on you move to Montana alright that one they just went with it I had no say in that but one of my favorite things all these headlines if you guys check reddit I think these some of these articles were submitted and one of my favorite comments was I don't even know where Montana is how are they first or like you know where is Montana and we're still first it's excellent okay so cell
phone privacy was not the goal the real story starts to the bill that i will refer to as HP 400 which was the montana data privacy act the goal is to use different legislation across the world to create a balance act to protect data there's a lot of good ideas why not put them in together and form something that will protect the average citizen constituent the the real battle over HP 400 is what gives us the insights into what everybody has to face across the states with the privacy policy challenge so i'm going to talk about a little bit of the policy frameworks of HP 400 because we knew we were embarking on a large journey and i'm sure you know we figured you know 6-12 months ago however long it was that we probably weren't the first ones to go me privacy is important so we looked at a lot of other different frameworks that we want to talk about and there's a lot of really excellent model laws if they were passed or not on individual states and foreign countries that are excellent father for basing it off of so first we looked at California Civil Code and in it we got a really excellent idea and it reads each agency shall maintain in its records only personal information which is relevant and necessary to accomplish a purpose of the agency and this is important because it's basically arguing that agencies are only allowed to collect information that's pertinent to them and so we like that idea it's the idea that you know all these different companies and agencies shouldn't just have these huge drag nets collecting all of this information that they don't need it's the idea that okay business has to get done but you don't need to go much further than that next we want to
Massachusetts loss Massachusetts has some excellent privacy legislation part of their part of it says section 2 regulations to safeguard personal information of Commonwealth residents this is important because we got the idea that if you collect information yes should probably be careful with it you know a great example is South Carolina how many you guys heard of that breach yeah South Carolina got owned hard they lost millions of their residents and citizens information names Social Security's I think the whole nine yards if you have that information you should probably I don't know secure it if you need it and so this is the argument that for businesses and government that if they do have this information they shouldn't just leave it on a windows XP box or something some of the actors in the crowd right it's like trivial to steal at that point you have to actually care enough to make sure it's secure next we got the duty to report known security breach or unauthorized use this basically gives us the idea that okay so now we have companies hopefully collecting only the information they need and actually protecting that information and if they're protecting that information they should know when they're breached which means that citizens should be alerted to that if your information is stolen and you don't know it you can't react to that businesses shouldn't just try and cover it up and go all that never happened because it did and it impacts people and is necessary for them to to let them know that mex it we want to Germany
privacy laws so a little side note about me is all my grandparents were immigrants some half of my grandparents for my mom slider from Italy for my dad's side his parents are from Russia and they had to move away from Russia when we took over and took out the Czar's all that good stuff so I always had a skepticism about you know let's or let's look at other historical past issues that have happened what happened in other countries why is it bad how can we learn from it I think it's really good especially if I'm setting policy to be able to how well insight into history to make sure we do not repeat our mistakes or other countries mistakes well Jeremy sees Germany Jeremy's data privacy laws basically they have a few things that we looked and liked and I think the most of the reason why these were created was because the Stasi when the cold war era was the secret police were watching over East Germans it was collecting also information about them as it was the secret police so I from what I understand these laws are put in place to protect the German citizens and that includes preventing organizations from collecting any personal I personally personally identifiable information without obtaining permission from an individual and that includes name birthdate phone number IP address personal address things like that then there needs to be permission for the collection of data which must be specific including how we're how long and for what purposes the data will be used and then individuals may revoke permissions at any time and policies procedures controls must be put in place to ensure that all the organization's data is being collected this is a major point this is the consent to have information collected will hit that over and over is one of the most important points of our entire pieces of legislation ok so the creation process
are you going research oh yeah I'll talk by research thanks comrades Oh Luca I'm just kidding so a lot of research went into this a lot but that's a good thing because we were able to say hey we took a look at what everyone else is doing how it impacted those other countries and we could use them as a use case and go hey look Germany can do it why can't we because what the whole process lobbyists business people everyone just kept going that's impossible that's never going to happen and it's nice when you can have a clear case that goes yes it's already been done and so we did research into what everyone else is doing and into what we wanted to do we're going to talk a little bit more about that when we go in depth on HP 400 but basically what we did we research the bills we drafted this lengthy human readable document something that you and I could understand and then I kind of tossed it over the fence to Daniel let him handle it the best thing about a state with a very low population as I went to college with Eric that's how I originally know him he gives me a call he's like hey let's look at this type of policy we're trying to do this while all of a sudden I'm the representative and I call legislative services with the with the draft that he wrote and he put together and I sent it to them who then put it into a bills form that is your true form of representative government of my opinion so we did that's exactly what happened and the Legislative Services is a group that works for legislators to like I say put it in form that can actually become law and goes from our notes sketched out to to a basic form language it's the foreign language called legalese exactly as far as I'm concerned so then they send it back we read it we say no that's not exactly we met we send it back they do it and then we send it back until we both think it's pretty good and then and then it all came together into dunked on HP 400 this is the big bill this is the mean potatoes of our presentation this is our basic lining out of what we want to see privacy and not only Montana but the United States so we're going to talk about the main points of the bill and then some of the issues that we had getting it passed I mean I call me naive I kind of thought oh well put all these great ideas together and then they'll get passed by government turns out it's a little bit more involved in that so we're going to talk about that some of the issues and and go from there so to talk about the main points a lot of these you know it's going to feel like you've already heard him before because I talked about other types of legislation that we had pulled from so point one of HP 400 was that data subjects must be given notice when their personal information is being collected pretty easy right it's something that would be fairly easy to implement and fairly easy to do it's saying that if you are giving your information up and a company is going to be using it they have to tell you it's building awareness because a lot of people don't realize that when they get that information or when they go to safeway and use their safeway card which gives them a five cent discount they don't realize that there's a secret little transaction going on where the company is basically getting all of their purchase history and then selling it they need to realize that they need to be told this is happening next is personal information may be used only for the purpose stated and not for any other purpose and this kind of ties in with the California law which is saying that they should only have the information necessary to do their job so you know there's no reason for your bank to be selling information or using it in a healthcare manner it's basically keeping these things separate and distinct next is personal information may not be collected disclosed without the data subjects consent as it stands currently your information is being rampantly bought and sold without even you knowing without your consent and that is a problem you need to have ownership of your date you need to know where it's going who has it why it's being sold do we get on points 4 through 7 personal information that is collected must be kept secure from any potential abuses already kind of talked about this if you're going to have data you should protect it next Davis subjects must be informed as to who is collecting the personal information you've got to understand who's collecting your information so that if they do have it you can reach out and say hey I would like you to delete that or hey I'd like you to update that because that ties into data subjects must be allowed access to their personal information to make corrections on any inaccurate data kind of one of the ones that we kind of slid in there at the end because the idea being your information is being traded all around and it is needed for legitimate business in certain circumstances and so because it's your data you should have the opportunity to update it one of the great examples as credit reports right now it's kind of a black box on where they get their information from and who knows if it's accurate or not you should be able to review it and go no that's not me or that's when someone stole my identity and have the opportunity to fix it and then we jump into data subjects must have a method available to them to hold data collectors accountable for following the principles in this section and this is one of the most poignant clauses in the entirety of this it's saying that people now have recourse for when their privacy is taken they have a recourse for when these companies rampantly disregard for their privacy
they now have legislated action that they can refer to in civil civil suits if a company violates this we have in our Constitution but by having in a law it allows to do so much more so that was HP 400 in a box so we're now we're going to talk a bit about you know we have this great idea we built this giant framework for privacy what are some issues we had one of the biggest ones was definition so then we had opt-outs in extenuating circumstances and a little bit of things with small business where the biggest ones is definition issues when we wrote this when you when you get into a project you start using the terminology especially in technology you just kind of start to use the inside terms but to someone on the outside it doesn't necessarily make the same sense and so to counteract this we try to have all these definitions like agency blocking business collection and a lot of the legislators just kind of read it and blaze there a dries glazed over and it doesn't help with phrases like data subject being hard to differentiate from customer and individual so we realized we really need to tone down the language of the bill for Montana at least for it to be understandable by representatives and citizens alike okay so I'm going to go back to the politics side of it please don't get political and too motivated on your side of the aisle versus what I stand for I am a conservative Republican the Republicans had the house in the Senate this bill how do you keep it how to keep that in mind because Republican conservatives are very they listen a lot to uh to make sure that it's a business-friendly environment so it can stay competitive so they don't want to over-regulate industries well there are a few overreaching clauses and this apply the biggest one that that we had in that bill which was probably a little bit too far which I actually think it's too far myself now that I've really read it focused on it and I'll reader as quick as I can the business not may not refrain from conducting commerce within an individual solely because the individual refuses to consent to the businesses collection processing or used to the individual's personal information except when the personal information is genuinely needed for the business to provide the service or product requested to complete a financial transaction or to comply with the law basically this says if you want to get a cell phone plan with the cell phone company and they say hey we are going to collect your information you say no you're not and you don't give consent well this would say that cell phone company still has to give you a cell phone plan since their business isn't focused on uh since their businesses and focus on that information that they're collecting and that's wrong because if you don't want to work with them if you don't want to consent well I don't believe you should businesses to offer everything up you are now informed to collect your information you're going to go to the competitor who's saying hey I'm not collecting your information you're going to start buying their services that's why I think it should go so there are a few of our reaching clauses like this another one was the small business burden can small businesses comply say we have a local mom pop shop that clicks your information your address your your credit card information whatever there's some things that they're collecting well do they have the ability to have it all secure are they putting it in a secure location or they keep it on their desktop which they also use with the business on Excel spreadsheet which could easily be lost I don't have a I'm not going to say yeah this is really important not important that I stand for that I'm too concerned on either end of it because this was really a philosophical conversation that we were having in the house does it hurt smaller business well the question is should they be getting information and collecting it if they cannot keep it secure one of the many issues and points that were brought up okay so now we're going to talk about from the political side the people issues that I had to deal with this includes leadership issues the extensive pushback from lobbyists my favorite part the fact that was considered too long at 26 pages and that the representatives didn't really understand it or read it it's not all doom and gloom though because Daniel does have a really nice site I'm going to hit next for you just cuz I like it so much okay so this is the bill we have two days to get or the first page of it anyway we have two days to get signatures put on it I received 37 signatures from the house and the Senate out of 150 individuals the Senators and Representatives in Montana I got 37 signatures about a fourth who are supportive of this this was on both sides of the aisle I didn't get to talk to everybody I was trying to speak to members of the Appropriations Committee where I was trying to get the bill put into so it could be heard in that committee so had a better chance of surviving I wasn't completely idealistic thinking we would like it I knew the committee would have to go to to get it passed beyond so we could then get hurt on the House floor and then sent to the Senate and hopefully sign this was a really good achievement believe it or not this co-sponsors it means they may not support everything in the legislation but they support the idea of it and that's what's one thing that's great about Montana both sides the aisle some of the people who would not be in the same room together unless they're forced to have their names on this bill okay
leadership issues conservative leadership was in the house in the Senate I'm in the house I'm house representative so I was begging that this bill mine this really important bill that no one else really cared about at that point because they were worried about their making Montana more job friendly or doing some of the taxes we had a 307 million dollar surplus that they worried about how are we going to spend it or going to get back their focus was on different issues mine was about down here on the priority list of importance so they promised I my bill would end up in the Judiciary Committee the Judiciary Committee is where we talk about gun bills gay rights abortion bills sex slavery I mean all the hot items the press was always in there this is the committee where they battle it out and you can believe and you can bet that this committee is very stacked on the Republican and Democrat side it's the people more worried about liberties and rights than they are about lobbyists telling them what to do and since privacy i think is a big rights issue this was the perfect bill or perfect committee for my bill it's also a committee that a lot people don't want their bills to go into because it's where their bills tend to die I was begging to have it in there please put my bill in appropriations well in the end leadership was not concerned about it and my bill is starting to cause some issues because there's a lot of a big business special interests that we're pushing against it from the start and so the bill ended up being put in the business and labor committee to be killed oh so we're going to talk about
the lobbyists side of things I do not really like lobbyists or a lot of special interests they're hard people to love they're like the same class as neither life maids well I'll tell you one thing Cidre exactly exactly from a side note politicians think they're really smart so they know that they appeal the special interest they'll get help for campaigns they can get reelected and then they can serve again and then they'll do what they need for the special interest to get more money to then serve again and it's like why the hell are you in politics is my question if that's really what you're standing for well I had some issues with them because some of the representatives and business and labor committee especially serve as easy votes to their sponsors AK lobbyists they're like this isn't my issue I'm serving because of one big issue so I'm going to do what you want along the lines for all these other ones they hear our bills bad they're like oh here's three ball points it's bad it grows government all those things I'm going to kill it well this was painted from a lot of the bigger lobby groups as more regulation and growing government it was a bad bill and as a conservative Republican they were just painting me as a rhino a sellout a moderate like Oh Daniel this is just bad legislation and we need to get rid of this I'm in reality they were concerned about losing the ability to profit from consumer information they make a lot of money from it there's really no standards so they don't want standards put on it yet and this is the conversations that some of us had behind the doors the funny thing is we're trying to put standards in place that will protect the business and says saying it's illegal to collect information like some individuals want to do we're just trying to have a balance to make sure people have their rights involved well they didn't want any of it because at this point in time they can put have the push back to kill some type of legislation I obtained a very quick reputation with my quick tolerance for lobbyists and I learned later on from a from a nicer older gentleman who's been around the block that they called me the mad Russian and half and I guess they were kind of right in some some regards okay so also the understandability problems partially a generational problem politicians tend to be old I'm 6 i'm serving in the House of Representatives so young democrats or republicans knew what we were talking about in this privacy issue they knew the how far technology has gone last 10-15 years i mean i am not a techy guy ironic i'm speaking at DEFCON eric is the guy I rely on for that but even I understand that this is a big issue that we need to work on and at least protect some rights if we can that's the way I'm looking at it uh there were all the representatives in there on the business and labor committee who helped kill the bill in the end that that barely knew how to use computers that didn't have a smartphone I mean some barely use their phones at all it was very interesting that they're the ones that we're trying to appeal to and they don't know what we are talking about also there's a lack of awareness on a privacy issue not an important issue there are bigger issues like I said we had 300 some million dollars to spend that's a lot more fun spending other people's money then trying to protect people's rights here's a really quick this really quick story i'll have on the side there was a facebook or a bill that we called the facebook bill it was more than just facebook it was it would prevent employers from collecting employees login information passwords things along those lines the city of Bozeman was doing it for a while until they got sued there were other organizations saying hey you want to work for me I need your login information your password so i can search through your email account search through your facebook and to me it's the same thing as hey you want to work for me i got to search through your house and your underwear drawer first it's a little bit a little bit too much so we're just trying put some guidelines in place it passed the Senate 48 22 it got killed in the business and labor committee let me go back pass the Senate 48 22 this was a very controversial Senate that got some national headlines for how much they hit their heads and they all voted besides two of them for this legislation business and labor committee it goes to their the business lobby tells a lot of the business and labor guys this is bad legislation it needs to be killed and I heard a story on how there was a guy a representative in his 70s didn't even from what I understand barely knew of facebook even is much how to hack it and he barely knew what it was he heard that he asked a younger guy a younger representative hey he's good legislation is bad legislation the younger guy who appeals to lobbyists and does basically plays the political game the exact opposite of me plays it he told them all this is a really bad bill this is really bad it's really bad for business we need to kill this bill and there's her policy setting right there older guy doesn't know what he's doing younger guy says kill it because you know what he's more worried about getting a better voting record at the end the bill sizing issue the bill is 26
pages long this is a and it's all new legislation this is considered a big bill by Montana standards Obama's Affordable Care Act I really don't care again what side you are on with that issue but that bill itself is a thousand pages that's a big bill in my opinion this is 26 pages in Montana legal speak in a sense that it's really easy to understand Montana code you can read it not having any law experience and just read it and understand exactly what the codes doing very simple this bill is considered 26 pages long and that was way too long it was complex into it we would have to have our own privacy standards for Montana than the rest of the country which is what we wanted so then yeah it's what we wanted because then we wanted other states to follow our legislation if we can do it then you can do it it also proposed a lot of new ideas in one document and if things you don't understand that her new can be kind of scary so we could be ran into those issues now let me go on the committee meeting there were two proponent I was a sponsor so I spoke first there were two proponents of this of this bill one was Eric so thanks for showing up to that way I figured I should probably wake up to that one yeah an ACLU I was so happy someone was sitting next to me in that meeting that irony is that as a conservative Republican I'm usually over here the AC use over here but now it's not only me a few of us are trying I think they're ignoring us for a while because we're bothering up so much we're trying to find more legislation like this to because we agree on privacy legislation to work on so I'm very thankful they were supportive and that now they're willing to work on other legislation the cell phone privacy bill there were also big supporters of so I'm very happy about that there's some reaching across the aisle for you the line of opponents were supposed to be the guys in my group camp usually in politics and that include the Montana retail Association the Montana Telecommunications Association there are multiple insurance companies Montana auto deals dealers association the Montana Bankers Association multiple hospitals the Chamber of Commerce Montana Collectors Association and the Montana data Association I mean if that room would have also exploded there had been no more lobbyist for the business front in Helena it was it was so absurd that they literally queued to say the same thing it was like they were lining up between each other like raising their hand and it was more than said on why they didn't like it which was just basically it hurt business yeah well it has a new representative I think they really wanted to prove a point to me as well that hey you're not going to be doing what we need you to be doing then this is what's going to happen I am a very slow learner so I guess next time we'll see what happens also the committee meeting let me just touch on one thing on politics say you are all about privacy legislation you're with me you know all about it well as representatives we deal with legislation across all these different areas so how much do you know about farming okay there's a farming bill how much do you care about it i'm from round of montana and i still wouldn't trust my my views on farming to know what this legislation is going to get past so i have to depend on someone else it's not really my issue this sounds good there's it's a short bill it's three three main points for it three main points against it I'm hitting 10 20 bills a day I'm trying to read understand pass so this was basically their farming bill in a sense they were not concerned about a privacy rights it's not an issue it's a non-issue issue so on the doors I knocked on a lot of doors for my campaign no one really is talking about privacy rights okay they're talking about money they're talking about taxes they're talking about jobs not not this issue so that committee members were pretty much unengaged so in a roundabout way Thank You prison for bringing away ernest to the issue ya gotta look at the silver lining just a little bit ok so the end result was that it was tabled in committee debt that Ellie I said is in the wrong committee in the first place and nearly all the lobbyists that that go along with the Republican side were supportive were not supportive of any type of privacy legislation they're like well you know we want to work with you to get it when they talked with me about for the bill is presented they wanted to be exempt from it they don't want it to apply to them and that's not really what we're trying to do or trying to make sure that personal information belongs to the individual the bill was too large and most legislators didn't understand the premise of why we need this legislation like I said before it was a non-issue issue and then again it was also HP 400 was called was considered growing government and creating unnecessary laws I was considered all of a sudden a big government conservative and as I just whatever that they can call they could label it however they want uh that was fine i prefer the nickname mad russian for you yeah you too nice so the end result was sadly the demise and death of HP 400 but like a phoenix from its ashes we will rise again with more policy and more effort what we did and what we realized is we tried way too much 26 pages for montana is about 25 pages longer than most other bills so we're going to try and break it down we realized that at that time privacy didn't affect people directly it wasn't something that could tangibly see and touch and be afraid of or happy about and so we were two or three months ahead of our time and then we didn't really compromise it and then you know more so is I want thank you for being solid and not compromising on privacy kinda he was there the whole way to make sure that we had the full privacy but what we also realized is at a certain point you know businesses still have to operate and we can't just put on a lot of legislation to you know to make privacy better on the the citizen right side but make it so burdensome that a small business can actually operate so we realized you know we still need to work with these people and then some additional thoughts we were new to the process six years old first time serving there's still a lot to learn yeah yeah rumah had to grow there's a lot of informal and formal opportunities that we didn't quite realize how to be done we didn't fundraise apparently you need money to push ideas I know however we're working on it and we didn't have a motivating story we didn't have a story that basically you know people could latch on to we didn't have a story that people can look at and go oh my gosh this is why I need privacy and two Olympics and we now kind of have that story with prism so there was some funny unexpected results that came out of it okay so this
is an award that I received from another fellow representative the order of the black helicopter for a representative Daniels only call for the extent of standing conspiracy theory creation from the man in the yellow hat and he gave me a black helicopter as well I set it right here on my desk for the rest of the session which is funny cuz have you talked to him since he did that yeah actually yeah I spoke to him and he has he said you sorry and that he definitely supports my legislation now so so another thing was that lobbyists took me a little less serious are some took me more serious if they won against anything I was doing they spoke to me because they knew I could care less on their stances that I was not okay with the whole special interesting not keeping other people in mind so I get taking a little bit less serious by some who just don't really speak to me at all oh those are the ones I probably respect a little bit less anyway and then there's some that i talked with and they make sure where I'm at and they see where I'm at it's a good thing they have there's a lot better communications and it's served a lot better um also a lot of groups and Representatives especially know my views on special interests I am NOT serving for that a special interest i'm serving for what i think is best for people that's what i thought government was books mostly for and you know it my reelection will be a little tougher but that is why I'm there and now and now I'm getting a lot of support so it's
fine okay so like I said we're revising the strategy we're going to break it up we had seven points we're going to break it down into seven individual topics so that each one can have a compelling story so we can build support so we can work with people we're going to create clear cases for each new bill we're going to work with businesses to ensure that they understand our goals and that we understand their hardships ellipses to a point right because at a certain point business would would rather just not worry about it I've got their information I'm not going to worry about securing it and so it's about building a balance so we have a goal I want to enter a little bit about it okay consent it's only two pages about it's got just the first part of the bill consent is the most important part because it says that this information being collected is actually your information not the people or the organizations and apartments that collected it's not their information still yours so in consent implies just that if you give consent most people will give the consent anyway but we need it to say that this actually does belong to me it's the first step on a ladder to privacy and if there's time we've got some more laws on the books at dance sounded really quick there's the protecting sources of the press I think this is one of the most important ones we're playing around this one still Thank You First Amendment like I said we need to start legislating our rights it's a sad time that we have to do that but since we've realized that we need to start today and that includes protecting the press and then there's also allowing citizens to disable black boxes from their car simple along those lines you drive around you're not you should not be having collecting evidence to get yourself for possible future cases last one is banning automated license plate scanning and collection for the state of Montana yeah Montana has a red light cameras are currently already banned in Montana so we are just continuing that up that yeah we're working on so this oh you go for oh sorry yeah we're in our final minutes who are speeding up it all leads to model privacy legislation Montana is now a test bed for privacy it's a test bed for this legislation so other states can go with their lobbyists tell them this is never going to happen you can go Montana did it states rights setting a legal precedent for privacy and working with citizen to not lobbyists that's what we're working for so thank you it's hard to get angry this early in the morning but we're almost done we're almost under what and I'm going to redo something from wired magazine that gets me a little annoyed a little angered if you will and so I think you will too when you hear the Obama administration for the first time responded to the spy gate lawsuit telling a federal judge the wholesale vacuuming up of phone call metadata in the United States is in the public interest does not breach the constitutional rights of Americans and cannot be challenged in a court of law I put emphasis on the very last bit of that the executive branch is telling the judicial branch that they cannot challenge that and I submit that when the people can no longer challenge the government that government cannot necessarily be called a democracy thank you and at the end of the day all of us are responsible for the policies that we live under so there's still power in the States and we need to pay attention but do more than pay attention do more than voting you hear people say if you don't like politics go vote I submit take it one step further become a legislator get involved in policy because you can make an impact we already have laws based on two people that have full-time jobs and felt like making a difference so with that I feel like donating to exactly when you split some yeast and though I might I mentioned he's inspired me to run for the next session as well yes Eric and I will both be running this next time in Montana the whole thing is if you stand up to special interest sometimes you lose their support but Montana has really low contribution limits of 160 dollars a person so the whole thing is when it's that low I can say goodbye to those guys in hello to people across the United States who support this type of legislation want to see it be done somewhere and actually see it put through so and so we also included our friend Bryce Bennett he's actually a Democrat so if you're very I won't donate to a Republican we care about privacy that's what we care about so if you want to make an effort and you want to do something with dollars right here or if you want to contact us and work with us on legislation we love that too so guys thank you thank you
Loading...
Feedback

Timings

  448 ms - page object

Version

AV-Portal 3.19.2 (70adb5fbc8bbcafb435210ef7d62ffee973cf172)
hidden