Bestand wählen
Merken

Do Robots and Digitisation really fit the demands of an ageing society?

Zitierlink des Filmsegments
Embed Code

Automatisierte Medienanalyse

Beta
Erkannte Entitäten
Sprachtranskript
the if the hello
from my side and likened to the panel discussions about robots and thus digitization and held fit the demands of a super aging society then in the next town we'll have a look at the potential of parity and robotics in the field of elderly cat which is 1 where demographic change will who does most we will focus on scenarios in industrialized countries like Germany and in Japan where concepts like society 5 comma decimal 0 already further develops
after 1st discussion with our expressed I invite you all to ask you questions so you reserve some time for that in the end my name is not this and have the pleasure to introduce the experts now that we have here today and the first one is kind of the chain all these high the
the senior researcher at the University of Eagan and has brought his co-worker pepper with their that Bryant had the best experience in the health
sector and has worked in different European research projects in elderly care and right now his projects our focus on the implementation of Roberts robotics Inc cat comparing Germany and Japan yes low it's my pleasure to be here with you but who they had they were the and then we have background that's you
not he's an engineer and academic research that has moved to Japan right after a degree funded and has done after some relevant work experience even a PhD in Japan did collaborated with researchers around the globe and the main areas of interest I human physiology human sensing and communication affective computing and human machine interaction comes in
the explain things to me and then the end would not use the phone in the office
is that when he worked on improving elderly care variety technologies and he thought that the support of several others up and did some business development or Internet in Berlin High and the other on
so that's bad right and began produce not but and the challenges that I mentioned that we are facing and how do you think technology can help us with that the 1st 2 words about what I'm doing than about within jobs are doing is in confidence care this the taking something that is very very manually for years indicates and
using IT technology to automatize it's in a certain way and help people without that is so in incompetent care and the defecation urination so what the problems are we already have a problem everyone knows that poly here with many old people that are getting more and more that's not bad thing we want people to go over and over the thing is we don't get enough babies meaning the tree of old to young looks worse every year and next year to have more people about 60 then under 30 right so the people that can care are getting less and less people that need care are getting more and more and so how can technology help with that I think we can do 3 things probably that's either there's more people that care meaning we import people to take care of our older ones because we can do it all or we train people and incentivize people to go into that direction and profession or his acknowledging combined with others to assist the people that care for more people to do their jobs better and better and more efficient and we're on the last sites so using IT so technology that wasn't there before 2 to assist in known came
I would like to have a look at how that looks like a red means of fanfare I lived there for some years now how would you describe the Japanese attitude to robotics and I want to kids fish sold by grows some
movies that may be weak issue just to have an idea of you what's
we changes and think the the kind of
of that you and the who will be
have the toggle the fun and you kind I think real the husband of found a novel way to fill their in 2 minutes interview with children called minus grandchildren their into their lives the book I don't you know what this is in there should be a local
come policy and a lot of things in
Thailand was a digital men the the animal and then we'll talk that much they created their their without article at the Wilkinson will have a kind of that so along with with of the and if you don't know the you have in my mind I Yoshiaki isn't the loans loans Japan faces some of the problems with among the aging population and the use of marriage if you of in a the prime Minister solution is do the which is exactly what happened in the spectrum I
would the some of
the my model you got that right from 1 of the 2 to 1 of the things they is so good book but he had on Monday at because you find the small the penalized the ranks becoming the day but the we love them like new who like here the other humans and robots side by side making pattern of communication systems 15 thousand dollars of
things these robots cost much less than if
you work in a solid and then I think that you the goal of the thing the of the of the of the of the of the
about the most of you the
I think the these workers and to
find out what it is not I enough you this so I think that
probably the pieces is the situation in Japan at the moment and maybe slightly different from the approach you have in Europe and the I think
this depends also on the culture background late in Japan and the culture the CSO also comes from the region that everything as a soul and soul this approach of being light treating the Robles like other sensing being is living normal that might be completely of normally you but it's bacos everything in Japan as a sole so basically even the items be they can interact they have their part of the wreath of nature so all the sadia use that the probe was cave maybe for European point of view is a little bit too much that the ideas that we indirectly robot in out their initial weight so I think this is the main difference in approach between Japan Europe where for example my mother I drove the like a vacuum cleaner role will be easy and she will it's like I can I can buy myself I don't really need a revolver but mean so it was like I just skip what is a very small thing so maybe we should work a little bit to meet in the middle like use the Robert as I don't see maybe completed partner but to be able to use the potential that what was said We'll be like in Japan they had trying to k here thank you Sarah I would like since we have 1 year I would like
to ask what is it that you do exactly in
your projects with a all the projects at the University of the mainland together with students and can't scholars in real situations but care elderly people together with the other right and carrots they tried to find out how I can help because participatory design God and that what in detail but who are you doing than in all camels around the I can do very well I can't hear sold speaking and recognize emotions in or out of year and the latter that terrible present seniors for example ill-intentioned praying every time so how we can channel this and so I had recently extended and what are you are not able to do and also not willing maybe to do but I don't think I want to tell you I really care activities like coming dressing and oddly activities from human to human in the future I can create free time for the chapters that they can spend more time for the activities with the elderly that it's my great potential so that means you want to act as assistant the carols maybe you have more time isn't years the so I know what what is the experience how all the people in Germany react that's a laugh so to say very different marry show 1 of
all movies again thank you for doing that I that great yeah so this is the situation if the movie right now would stop then
a you I think that there in 1 of which forms the land and that it's there are interacting with the robot of humans the realization there has to be in together with scales for law and the this is really the kind of part of the Simon the units that are in and and not only that but this will not any usually there is some of the reluctance from in the order of because there are of course not used to such a machine but then by the design because I think we all can agree that offer that both nicely designed to be a companion and not
like a killing machine that the the what the European Society usually about
robots that there are destroying us that they're taking over the world some out that's how impression in Europe very different to the situation in Japan as the star has already explained that a robot always this is seen as helpful role and the young and then after a 1st contact and it is really just mentioned that to me and know a very positive to that robot to the order of most of the time as you can see here and that's the reality in all settings and also the capital
assumes the because in the beginning of cause they might think that such a robot make might steer the chopped over a certain period of time but after being in contact with that machine they immediately realize that I could never be the case at least not for the time being so if you bring that to the new technology into real practice and include there's 2 people which of the many of them in that's just accepting it can go there I this is so what we have
learned in all so far and so you know this is not what I can say hey to this aspect and then with ongoing time this summer after all that it's really you want to
try to build up a relationship to the machine of work as I said before and it's really nicely designed it's a talk was them it's bringing some fundamental to them with ongoing time it's really that I like most of them of course not all them and the yard and also with the Minsky the operations it it it works well it was the music not because he's really able to
analyze movements exercise and stuff and so I got to be something like activity of what we could to move in to seeing and we'll selecting than the old songs from the fifties and the sixties which the could sing together with the robots and they're really doing so this is sort of depression but it's only shot we do not yet have long term that is where the robot for example
on the site such a and this is where we are applying for in research and development projects in Europe and Germany and we hope that we will present successful with this but for the time being it's only shot contact we have their 1 2 of what we do almost every
2nd week so that people already in use of the raw scores yeah and you can see that the embodiment of the movement of arms and so on so we well that the senior also really doing it like it would be the the physiotherapists or exercise right up
and that will be there as assistant the you
end and I would like to ask you a question at least in some great examples through like support emotional Soupault with a
robot but of course high efficiency in automation can also lead to a business case and care and how can we make sure that it's not just about cutting costs and so questions to the audience what cutting costs you have 2 car dealerships there's 1 so when you the cover you want for 20 thousand the other 1 for 10 thousand was divided 20 thousand car
your cousin half the same products I think it's quite good so I I 1 cut to cut costs in every way possible to cut cost by 50 % you can either leave it at that have the same quality or you stay at the crossing of double the
quality of or service of care stuff like that right so we're about yes cutting costs right leaving out stuff you don't need to do right false positives false negatives take those out through and through that and sensing and then try to increase the quality with few among people because you would be will have your among people think that's a fact we don't want is a factor and there's always and with every technology there's going to be problems and people when cars came up or trained we can travel at speeds were going to die all not because we're craft wouldn't die because of the speed it there's always going be some naysayers very name and very and it's not any of those colleagues someone the middle right by thinking care especially with stuff like this people in care fundamentally good that's what I believe in I don't go to care to make lots of money it's not the monetary self it's you're a good person normally thing on average maybe more than other and parts of the industry and it's not about replacing words about a system like this thing will not replace I think the contemporary higher 5 robots that can assist in that time maybe you don't have with the patient that time will get better or assist during the time you have the patience so we get snow replacing adding it's assisting
same for us It's assisting to make more of the time a quality but if we think about implementation on a larger scale and
pepper what's legal framework i.e. operating in right now we interact with other people and you know and and politicians and the relatives can help me and questioned whether it was related investors in together with the chair and the fragmented from actions and status in areas and how many people questions if you can turn to Intel's thinking of a and genes of this thing that think I think and act I now in and other that and by the I can explain it like this and why we need it in this context here I I think it's really needed in this context because it is a very sensitive context isn't it to the caring of all the so we all know to caring in Germany and most parts of you wrote this a private business and that might be the problem so even if we are able to to to gain the carers a bit more time by the support of such a robot it could be the case that there is saying is still are again then invested into a new work and not left for the people really to do you with the human beings so putting values inside to such a machine it's very important we all know about artificial intelligence autonomous systems they if we are talking about self-driving cars OK there's the problem of decision-making in specific situations but other other all other aspects are more or less engineering staff smoke yeah how would such a priority is everything fine but in such a sensitive setting like was older adults and caring for the older lots of course and we have to take a lot of care human rights are a some all embedded in such machines of calls that that was a very high priority not to interfere with those human rights also the responsibility they of such machines all the manufacturers all operator of the machines that will can
be held guilty of something that's wrong for example if we extend such as machine it to remind all the evidence taking medicines and there might be something like an endless loop or stuff
like that that he's always saying please take you directly please take your diuretics and so on and on it there is a serious harm to such order lots of course it that's also very important that we can make somebody responsible for that and for such things we need to to such responsibilities measure and also the possibility to detect that after afterwords in the machines that's also it very important was that really got an aunt down there is to use me years now and
as that he's universe than because we're talking about now attack many like standard and would you say is the same no it's of course there the there are very peak cultural differences which also have to be taken
into account and this is something for example in Germany where we have a lot of forum you are citizens like from Turkey and they're also going into the care homes that's something very completely different the values and norms of such knowledge human beings and and senior was and this has also to be taken into account and also very important is the transparency it because in a human being and want to know what such a machine is right now doing and we have to provide metals which are able to show and to such a transparency that the human being always knows what's going on and such a machine and also refers of course to reasons behind move because it is clear that not everything like the speech or even if it would be connected to chat bots is going on directly into much in the machine is so it's connected to the Web it's connected to the fault and most of the services are running in the cloud and he's always looking he's always hearing using
deferring so a lot of state terror scares
and this data privacy aspect of security aspect of course this also belonging or very important aspect value based design and we have not by the end of the
month so I think the new group in general data protection rules in which you us as citizens and also the senior
the good choices to make things have more amount and so so the data it is security aspect of privacy is very important and also the validation and certification is of such machines so that it can be you are followed back in in
the case of something happening what does not wanted before on that we can make somebody responsible for that and to know finally I think that also in the industry the yacht in the future and already all the people manufacturing and building and developing such machines at takes they are not really a metal there and that should from my
perspective also be changed that those people were constructing such such machines if you have a good chance to learn about that it's because usually those engineers are not able to do it and not just by the caller going off to study and work it's not foreseen consumption educational the setting and also as I said before the industry so there's really a lot to do also a a related to social economics because if we are thinking 10 to 15 years in the future if those machines active there are not yet paying taxes and they're also not paying social insurance is and that's also a very important aspect to if we think about more and more of those machines are acting in all societies souls being for those taxes and for the social security
systems that's also important so the legal frame book it needs to be defined I think very soon it because those machines certainly will invade the online form step by step of course but that would be something which will happen and we need better also needed legislation I think on that issue young and then it needs to be social economically stable the people not lose too much jobs by that and I know that there is a social security for the people remaining means I would like to go bit deeper and the
topic of data that you mentioned also minor against what I mean we said there a vast amount of data graded when and when we use such systems that system do you know what can we do with that data collected look at it no so what's the sometimes when you 1st heard you things the some stupid right so if you say under combined predictive maintenance with incontinence care that some still in the beginning it's not as the right so if we look at what's what were we able to do in other manufacturing logistics and settings vitamin factor yeah bridge Manon's right see what you wanna know when something breaks are happens that you don't want in advance so you can act before it happens right we can do the same with columns river right out if we collect its at this is going back when the predict what's happening in the future right so you can for example route optimization it that's something that comes out of that you collect data who does what when and how much and then you can have real optimization how do I care for a person who I care for 1st that on ad-hoc basis if something happens for example defecation as that of your nation you can go to the person 1st that defecate it's because through his aggressive you don't want that anywhere near you at the small tells you stay away if you're in its you have a problem right your skin gets destroyed you have you know track infections such a secular infection in in Karim's and was a more for call ISO from excrements so if you know all that you can prioritize certain things which you can before without a doubt side before that you have your plan every 3 4 hours to do this and this and this something gets pushed away and if you know what's going on what's going on You can act on that and make it better the same as in every system that that that exists if you can then provide that for free or even save the people involved and have to pay more money than they have a business case and everyone's happy people dillis diseases are the dates less stress for the people involved so
we make money the demand factors make money the counter mind and once haven't smiling and health-care systems multi moric is it costs a lot of money to shield people that have you TI's in their latest years because they normally don't yield which is punished humane level very bad and for the coal system also so yeah please it is you collect everything you'll
find stuff that makes sense the rest you don't collect any more the stuff that works you provide people with actionable insights so they can change the processes to to something better of and so there will be or there are many privacy concerns and break adding and regarding the topic so could Japan in that sense the inspiration can we how do they deal with those concerns there few things I think collaboration between the Japan Europe or Japan Germany in this very important because the points of view are very different on many many issues the example of the seashore the usual on their privacy the privacy of exemplary in Japan is a slightly over looked at the moment mostly bacos and they never we never had such progress before because every system in Japan is very close so for example even the rope was you've seen they named industrial settings they all to get there in the setting in that company everything is close everything is shielded from the outside so or the data that stays inside same for the whole setting it's like 1 home one-family everything stays inside but in this case think in Europe we have more into that globalization fo for a variety of reasons for example sharing data could be useful for studies on the health of all the improvement on the impact of the probe what's India in the fields resembling the care setting where the light want to do a longer studies on whether the robot is actually effective or not so in that case we need to share the speed of a hollow we shared the so the is more as a
concept all the western society the moment competitive and so we can I think collaborator many to many topics you I don't care and now the last Christmas I would like to open up the attentively audience is a bit about future works maybe against
can start and when you see where we can be in 5 to 10 years would but would be of vision no idea I have influence on what we're building somehow but the rest of Nordea just let them there's stuff happening a lot and them for example the robots superserver fun by super very assisting in what caregivers to and other settings to there's the that that's time aspect were adults dealt with certain diseases that's a good thing I think the the physical aspect of care That's why many people quit because their bodies just can hell anymore right there and care for a couple years but you have to have people from 40 kilos 240 killers given them some was the lying in bed so we have to do with this way with the run back that's not good right so insisting on the more physical side with I don't know of pixel skeletons now not can have next year in at least would react because then the physical pain you have as a caregiver and the hardship that goes away and you can assist instead of using force 100 per cent you have to use 10 % for the same force you you apply to something I was going and going on the reported
robotic side we can look at it
again where our mass market products manufacturers and use those system also in care to assist with the physical aspect the mental aspects is a whole whole different but they have no clue about OK thank you against so what's your point of view Our bio view into their hand is though cause droplets can just stay among us and indirect at the very nature level by the point also is that if you talk about industrial settings of course you have engineers that work on the role but they program the robot the others killed but if we want to use robots in a normal setting he you don't want retrain the people which means the seniors that also that the care that the care taken the caregivers that they already have a job so they don't wanna be retrained on trying to use the to by the something ceased so DATA is to have a robot that can understand for example emotions why do we need to win the emotions because emotions also the additional information on the state not the person which is direct recent directly there or what so if that person is angry there what might lead to something if that person is said the abutment do something different so it's also because it's easier to interact with a machine that can stand us that we don't need to be trained with the need to understand the robot there would understand that so that's why we have this approach heaps for better assistance think and Sn say and
you know I see his to potential for a hybrid teams of Carroll's human Carol's of Gaussian such robots will in the future because what we
see here is the crown to state of the art of the technology this is a product you can buy it everywhere in Germany in Europe all over the world it's roundabout price 15 thousand euros so it but then it came out of the box so with no abilities at all and you have to program it but finally it is the product and it's 1 of the 1st products of that kind so they will be short short Yau development in the next 5 to 10 years because we know from the research side that already European Community community and also the German government is spending a lot of money into those developments for example washing machine so the of false signals in C Newell homes that's that for the very common among them thought to be utterly like those projects already it you all
on the run them down are running and also it there are other machines in the next generation which are very easy
it able to manipulate everything to do that what has set up to lift up to people all of the bat they look down a bit like war machines so maybe you know the robots from Boston Dynamics of which have been funded by the U.S. American government there is no more on the military side not those machines are able to walk and those machines are able to make trips flop and also society and everything and also the artificial intelligence will develop very so the yacht severely in the next years so I'm I'm pretty sure that those machines as I said before will also and the care situation but calls on governments who are supporting the very much and there is I think the need to for that at least there are some hybrid activities together with human carers which could work
for example the night watch if you are in such a care-home it was 1 on that senior living there and
during the nights only to Carroll's human carrots or looking for the whole institution that's a reality it is more or less at least and in such a situation such a robot put out
very nicely some are patrolling over the the flaws and at least
detecting then if some of the senior seniors are leaving the room or are architected to what reasons of and then they can call if for example to reuse care of to take action and also if you think about the ambulatory care where the order that's still living at home and 2 we will have changes in the next case that more and more young people will leave the wall areas around seeing in all surrenders failure we have a lot of mountains and small villages where is really too situation there is no shop anymore that there is so I'm not so much physicians caring people and that the ongoing certainly
and then on such robots if they are developed further work would also be inside the homes and has been it is possible to and that would certainly develop in any case we need to a very good legal framework and we have to
discuss it more and more on society that's very important I think because otherwise so me OK have 20 years or something more to come to a coulomb or even 25 I do not know we do not want to sit at some sometime in the and there's suddenly such a machine is dealing with also there needs to be a legal framework as well that the individual can decide it where I wanted it or do I not want and that needs to be put in place because all was you know the industry would just do it like that it was a lot of other the IT devices and 2 we have to face it some almost so that's I think they're very very important aspect which should be the taking into account and where we also need to discussion of broader discussion in the society it
both to those statutory and so as anyone have a question has the might I think you for job talks and bring the videos and also the robot and so interesting I'm coming more from their political social science perspective and I always wonder why so we see the caretakers right now the human caretakers they rush through this Getchell they've got like 6 and a half minutes to do this task and then they go to the next person thing like it's 10 minutes per patient it's super super schedule and that this is the point of like cutting cost that's what we see what what happens when we use this this paradigm and so I wonder if we come from the idea that more human centered care will be better over that's our ideal why don't we use the robots to do all the the shitty stuff like the work paperwork and like all the things that and health bureaucracy consumes times
for and then let the human caretakers have more time for this emotional human-centered care because what you showed a what I saw was more like robots was doing kind of like the same social work but what about turning it the other way around just 1 example where that is already done not a given in health care general idea of and in the states for many many doctors to area I know we have a you have a doctor and he does where she does her work and then you have a lot of writing to protocol and then you don't sleep enough because you have to protocols and you can only see it this amount of people and you have enough doctors and so 1 alters the whole typing stuff right you talking to your glasses or whatever the someone sitting somewhere else life typing at the end of the day or when you have a break you just say we threw it yes and that's a signature and that's how you can treat 2 times 3 times 4 patients that takes care of all the rubbish and the number 1 complaint if you ask is is documentation documentation and that's number 1 thing and there's people working on that that he would not exactly the same thing what you can do with with doctors we don't care we basically talk to the person something the automatically and but the system knows what you're doing then you have problems so again right out of solution but at the from caretakers snow if you know your your clients the needs 7 minutes for that person 1 a for that person but you have 3 minutes each of 3 minutes 15 each they will say this fans here the same demands here and allocated other if you have no documentations automatically can't do anymore yet a tree everyone the same which doesn't work think right so there has to be adjustments and that it has to be more flexibly I think and a further question that you just want to does wonders saving the example of where it's done already were no it's done and where everyone's happy so it's possible I will also try to answer that you question these of course documentation is a big burden for the care giver's form and they all ready systems available which make that
happen by speech documentation and that would also be good to use case for such a robot acting in the team Mr. assume caregiver it to make that maybe the be more easier now and also could be connected to piety and medical as records stuff like that the chilling in this it but this finally I think we're not solved the problem because the machines and also although digital pulse are able to do a
lot more and they are freeing if they're running well they're freeing time for the care of the problem is just all system because cares private in Germany and most countries in Europe but as I said before and every free time it would be you just again to invest that into a shareholder of you and that's again where we need such a legal frameworks to make that some molecules in our department it
the and also the lying in the system because I've been 15 years and farmer marketing It's also the matter of paying the people of course not but they only have 6 minutes it's it's
it's a matter of departure which the German outskirts system also the other European it's this is of providing to do that and why don't we have that money because fault for the carrots I mean we have a lot of money in the system I know that from oncology where a one year biomedical new drug treatment to gain its we amounts of more life expectancy costs more than 2 1 that calls euros a year and there we know a bit where the money is going and so that's
something which can only only be solved by saying to by all politicians and finally by us so to make the petition the this dual doing what any other questions please and little things representation peptic work in care is the cool because we all want to have somebody in front of us who understands we are as a person and I denote pepper as these abilities yet and can you tell us maybe in Japan What is the what is the science of knowledge robots that actually could be able 1 day to to do is peptic working can stay in science going in this direction there is
it costs like appraise the state of the art coming from Japan but the robotics in Japan He's everywhere and so we have like a lots of research in every direction and the use of robots in any field so the he's an example of what you can do or follow the rule would could be in normal settings there are different reports it could the answer is very tricky because the program using its as he said that like there are so many different issues and the issues of the you know the issue of design issues of of that acceptance participatory design because everyone has to accept the the robot and understand its limits me there are many so there are several studies on this so I think as you probably have seen already the role with these nowhere near to effect there the stroke was specifically cannot do any that you were at the latest so show this social parties also because we can use it as a study in study of that the case the fact that he said it becomes the press the product who it is not perfect but a good product and they cannot do anything you anyway you have to programming completely so depending on the cost you want to the to do you have to program it so it's not yet and easy if each word of mouth person to use but Hairer was a can do much more advances stuff in Japan the point of view is slightly different because Japan has been always across country it is difficult to reach it is difficult to say the country's lady friend though many people want to actually moving to bend and the demography nowadays the human bad so we have lots of elderly people and not many young people that can take off any all work so not that like even engineering or we have promised askew ingenious as we have for very easy or at least not not the rescue dogs so this study into reporting season very active in any field but these it has to be I think has to be seen in a more global perspective so the perspective of a difference
between Japan and Europe or at least the Western word for a variety of reasons that I chair but also the economic
and social situations so I think there are many things that we can take from Japan to Europe and there are also many many things today from Europe or from the Western world to which then because to to get more on a globalized that said yes who was going to very heavy stuff very petty tasks they really saying also I just find robust i.e. personally we presented a lot sex of 1 is for what we have ethics of news reporting my left and there we planning now to use it for music therapy Bayes being developed for like 20 years 1st with their own gunplay and then we had a few discovered and now we have a saxophonist over just for fun for the sake of doing so there are many many directions I
hope I answered the rest some things for talk again I've got a question for all I know you mentioned in this that you are with the elderly people interacting with paper that you have only short-term data and you will study of how people interact as far as I understood do you plan to collect any studies like 3 or 4 5 years because I can imagine elderly people getting used to that for water by Pepper and I am curious about if this is only a short-term effect to see people into acting like you showed as individual and now that's certainly true it at this so we can just
state something about that too the short term you to make such as long as that is that it's just a matter of resources of course no you would need to some of the robots that not that cheap and for the time being they need also a technician on the inside the cone to operate safely and to the fees feasible lump some all about 2 for example we we seeing working on that that we make something that available like a configurator which will run on a smartphone to make the abilities of the robot to lose some more adaptable to the care situation so that that could help them it not to bother people and to make every single individual what is certainly needed because every all the evidence the individual person and very very different ones so that's something where I think that this is very important to have such it has power of adaptability it at hand know it but on the other hand side to the ising here there's also a huge potential to connect to robots to to chat books it in the wet what is something what
we also try to to to establish at least because if he could do it in a very specific conversations about very specific topics which are a very interesting for the older adults for
example culture our arts so whatever this of football it that something what would play a very very important role to make such a machine in more feasible for long worked on satisfaction for the users and then I think that could really worked nicely and and so finally it of course everything when we talk about detecting and Pattillo detecting emotions it's always amounting to know what's going on there is no empty in such a machine it's just mathematics checking a specific face situations and whatever it is and to compare it with a broad it somehow and
2 so such a machine that I can only a human tissue care and this is really not what we want and sometimes the politicians are the
people defining such research programs seems to think that that could be there such a help to solve the problem of the but aging society and this is exactly what all upon a discussion today is about you I don't think that such a machine could solve those issues it could have well it could tell dramatically yes part 2 there is no chance to is some only exchange show that to reuse doesn't long and all care IT industry I felt that in follow earlier this year where they have met in the German fail it and the president off private care it in Germany they are planning right not to the import all the people from the Philippines and also from Vietnam and right now it's already a situation that that most of to support us from poland all area and on the other hand side of course this is dealing with a lot of power in those countries so for example Adobe kindergartens in the area and the only where the kids of those people were doing to care for our parents but no I would think too young they they have to take care of them and have
to look for them so it is not 1 magic pill which could solve the problem this we need a combination of all of us in began to answer finally a question I think if there's a bit more of resources available and we could connect such missions to
in a bit more of an interesting conversation stuff it could could work although a longer period of time but we do not have the in any case you need to design the those abilities machines done in that what we call participatory design I'm coming back to that again you have to do it in the real scenarios you cannot do it in the lab and then send it all to to somewhere the debt and so did Turing your question things anybody all
right thanks for each market think this is a question in Sarah I'm not sure if you're all familiar with the works of Sherry Turkle who was doing work at the MIT I believe researching human-robot interaction and she's been doing that for a couple of decades and there last books were pretty pessimistic and that was also the last thing I read about all and ethics debate with humans and robots and when you say there's no empathy in the robot that's obvious but we design them to simulate empathy obviously right papa has these big guys to look cute and non nonthreatening and also human I mean she could also be at black brought for all that so the intended purposes but we wanted to simulate human so is there any any data from from Japan maybe that has trekked which kind of the effects of emulators a simulated empathy has on the people because of the reduced showed I was just that pepper dressed up and and to elderly people who it believed this year as part of the home I mean that's also what we see was boson Japan very popular but not real talks so what what what kind of effect do we see on elderly people when they deal with such a machine for a long time in Japan then this
like a very very deep question I wondered reasons for Leetch reward we we are moving toward words humanoid robots instead of viral dog squares something is that there are many many studies that show that we are the the more we interact we some intelligent media which might be anything a computer you fall on the GPS we start to interact and the more nature of sponsors for example I yell at my GPS for the time when a get lost in the middle so if the stupidity it does this stupid but I still do it is like and then I realize OK maybe SME so all the appointees really interact a showing it we expect the machine to indirect nature so this is tricky because of course my loop unethical to try to to fake and that the human response but it's not really faking the human response is trying to not really showing that the to give an idea that a person can indirect nature and he'd the robot real ability to interact as naturally as possible so that best I would say point of view as ingenious because if you interact naturally with the robot and we can understand the what you want to say like emotionally speaking just communication than for us as engineer we have an idea what you want 100 % or at least 95 % because if I say see flopped but I'm laughing and giggling of course is I'm I want you to interact but if say state it and it would be the robot might want to stay 5 so this is our point of view and other a point of view is cost the famous uncanny valley that is in robotics of
the more the robot looks like a human or the active far because also involves worse similarly the more we attracted to interact and the last of the robot these responders and we expect expected to do the more
we we feeling in an awkward situations like I don't know what to do with this machine so a reason for which the spectra looks exactly in this way is that it it's obvious it's the robots right there you see it's a robot it's on Android it doesn't look like a human is a robot so I tried to indirect we need an if he falls short for some whatever reason I see think OK it's a machine obviously it's not a human there we had humanoids in our lab they farmers annoys core copy and you can look it up in the internet and it's 1 % humanoid we expressive face so not not fixes the robot can definitely express emotions steal it looks like a robot this white same way like it's obvious that it's a robot so you try to interact you also can understand what the robot is trying to express and you still see that it's set of what why for example she in is another guy to with the Android the gym anointed looks completely like a person and then you try to interact the for sure that you don't know very well what to do so that's what is it what happens is that the moment you don't know what to do you stop the robot is stuck to because we have no idea what was make the will do so how to react so this is 1 thing and but then becomes sleep of course they say why you were trying to fake the role just that treat because it's in Japan the perspectives very different and he sees this up because so also as Europeans most of our culture comes from the christian roots even if we might not be everyone was rescinded Laker we come from the we see OK solely using the leaving even the more radical the souls are only in the humans not even in the animals so it's like everything else is just an artifact in Japan it comes from the Buddhism in Buddhism even if people do not hold any more to the temple time but it's it's more everything part of the nature so even the the items people tend to interact and if it was so they be sets up the rowboat because no it's a reward obviously but somehow it's a linear views of prison before the eyeball they have few near us when the hybridized because they just do that but they also fewness for needles when you break assuming you know they have a special ceremonies for that in Japan Sony though is obviously not a robot right so that you can you can you give see the differences between perspective so it's not that we try to fake we tried to read on the benefits of having an understanding of what the human is doing and then everything else is oppositely we had the programmers so we're humans if we bring with us all the biases or the other programs so for example artificial intelligence that's a different thing artificial intelligence has to be program treated in a different way from the motion thank you Sarah I think we could go on there but our time is all of us I thank you all
for joining the session now gives them all inside of this complex topic and enjoy the rest of the day Thank you so much
the and
Roboter
Hypermedia
Expertensystem
Vektorpotenzial
Verkettung <Informatik>
Datenfeld
Gerade Zahl
Digitalisierer
Mathematisierung
Digitalisierung
Computerunterstützte Übersetzung
Ausgleichsrechnung
Roboter
Virtuelle Maschine
Telekommunikation
Subtraktion
Minimalgrad
Flächeninhalt
Interaktives Fernsehen
Implementierung
Projektive Ebene
Computerunterstütztes Verfahren
Computerunterstützte Übersetzung
Fokalpunkt
Bereichsschätzung
Prozess <Informatik>
Rechter Winkel
Ablöseblase
Wort <Informatik>
Softwareentwickler
Varietät <Mathematik>
Internetworking
Office-Paket
Arithmetisches Mittel
Web Site
Prozess <Informatik>
Rechter Winkel
Euler-Winkel
Hilfesystem
Roboter
Eins
Richtung
Familie <Mathematik>
Primideal
Punktspektrum
Informationsmodellierung
Rangstatistik
Kommunikationssystem
Rechter Winkel
Mustersprache
Spezifisches Volumen
Roboter
Roboter
Roboter
Arithmetisches Mittel
Vektorpotenzial
Bit
Subtraktion
Sichtenkonzept
Punkt
Gewicht <Mathematik>
Momentenproblem
Hochvakuum
Natürliche Zahl
Mereologie
Zustandsmaschine
Rechter Winkel
Reelle Zahl
Grundsätze ordnungsmäßiger Datenverarbeitung
t-Test
Notepad-Computer
Projektive Ebene
Sprachsynthese
Kombinatorische Gruppentheorie
Grundraum
Zentrische Streckung
Virtuelle Maschine
Einheit <Mathematik>
Mereologie
Gesetz <Physik>
Roboter
Virtuelle Maschine
Menge
Physikalischer Effekt
Reelle Zahl
Ordnung <Mathematik>
Frequenz
Roboter
Virtuelle Maschine
Nichtlinearer Operator
Trennschärfe <Statistik>
Gruppe <Mathematik>
Term
Quick-Sort
Roboter
Web Site
Notepad-Computer
Projektive Ebene
Softwareentwickler
Ortsoperator
Physikalisches System
Biprodukt
Teilbarkeit
Roboter
Überlagerung <Mathematik>
Dienst <Informatik>
Negative Zahl
Digitalsignal
Rechter Winkel
Mereologie
Wort <Informatik>
Schnitt <Graphentheorie>
Expertensystem
Umwandlungsenthalpie
Nichtlinearer Operator
Bit
Kategorie <Mathematik>
Stab
Gruppenoperation
Relativitätstheorie
Implementierung
Systemaufruf
Autonomes System
Kontextbezogenes System
Framework <Informatik>
Roboter
Virtuelle Maschine
Menge
Flächeninhalt
Rechter Winkel
Mereologie
Endogene Variable
Neuronales Netz
Loop
Virtuelle Maschine
Endogene Variable
Ordnung <Mathematik>
Einflussgröße
Chatbot
Virtuelle Maschine
Dienst <Informatik>
Benutzerbeteiligung
Subtraktion
Webforum
Kategorie <Mathematik>
Sprachsynthese
Normalvektor
Streuungsdiagramm
Virtuelle Maschine
Datenmissbrauch
Digitales Zertifikat
Computersicherheit
Endogene Variable
Validität
Gruppenkeim
Schlussregel
Auswahlaxiom
Aggregatzustand
Arithmetisches Mittel
Virtuelle Maschine
Bildschirmmaske
Rahmenproblem
Menge
Prozess <Informatik>
Perspektive
Computersicherheit
Physikalisches System
Minimierung
Automatische Handlungsplanung
Systemaufruf
Routing
Bridge <Kommunikationstechnik>
Physikalisches System
Teilbarkeit
Übergang
Softwarewartung
Multiplikation
Weg <Topologie>
Prognoseverfahren
Menge
Rechter Winkel
Basisvektor
Kontrollstruktur
Logistische Verteilung
Normalspannung
Beobachtungsstudie
Bit
Datenmissbrauch
Sichtenkonzept
Punkt
Prozess <Physik>
Momentenproblem
Gruppenoperation
Physikalisches System
Roboter
Kollaboration <Informatik>
Datenfeld
Menge
Varietät <Mathematik>
Skeleton <Programmierung>
Pixel
Menge
Forcing
Rechter Winkel
Physikalismus
Gebäude <Mathematik>
Maschinelles Sehen
Roboter
Subtraktion
Sichtenkonzept
Punkt
Physikalischer Effekt
Natürliche Zahl
Ruhmasse
Physikalisches System
Biprodukt
Roboter
Übergang
Virtuelle Maschine
Menge
Prozess <Informatik>
Information
Hybridrechner
Tropfen
Aggregatzustand
Virtuelle Maschine
Generator <Informatik>
Quader
Projektive Ebene
Softwareentwickler
Biprodukt
Aggregatzustand
Virtuelle Maschine
FLOPS <Informatik>
Bit
Roboter
Flächeninhalt
Gruppenoperation
Mathematisierung
Ordnung <Mathematik>
Roboter
Virtuelle Maschine
Framework <Informatik>
Roboter
Videospiel
Protokoll <Datenverarbeitungssystem>
Zahlenbereich
Physikalisches System
Elektronische Unterschrift
Roboter
Videokonferenz
Netzwerktopologie
Task
Scheduling
Client
Bildschirmmaske
Flächeninhalt
Fächer <Mathematik>
Rechter Winkel
Prozess <Informatik>
Perspektive
Datentyp
Vererbungshierarchie
Kontrollstruktur
Aggregatzustand
Virtuelle Maschine
Datensatz
Puls <Technik>
Sprachsynthese
Physikalisches System
Framework <Informatik>
Roboter
Bit
Physikalisches System
Sichtbarkeitsverfahren
Soundverarbeitung
Beobachtungsstudie
Subtraktion
Sichtenkonzept
Punkt
Selbstrepräsentation
Schlussregel
Biprodukt
Richtung
Roboter
Teilmenge
Datenfeld
Menge
Perspektive
Inverser Limes
Wort <Informatik>
Optimierung
Verkehrsinformation
Aggregatzustand
Task
Gruppe <Mathematik>
Wort <Informatik>
Richtung
Varietät <Mathematik>
Soundverarbeitung
Beobachtungsstudie
Subtraktion
Vektorpotenzial
Feasibility-Studie
Wasserdampftafel
Term
Roboter
Eins
Anpassung <Mathematik>
Konfigurationsraum
Ising-Modell
Smartphone
Drucksondierung
Aggregatzustand
Leistung <Physik>
Umwandlungsenthalpie
Virtuelle Maschine
Umsetzung <Informatik>
Mathematik
Virtuelle Maschine
Flächeninhalt
Mereologie
Vererbungshierarchie
Optimierung
Hilfesystem
Leistung <Physik>
Virtuelle Maschine
Umsetzung <Informatik>
Bit
Turing-Test
Schaltnetz
Frequenz
Beobachtungsstudie
Soundverarbeitung
Sichtbarkeitsverfahren
Sichtenkonzept
Punkt
Natürliche Zahl
Interaktives Fernsehen
Computer
Roboter
Virtuelle Maschine
Loop
Quadratzahl
Reelle Zahl
Endogene Variable
Mereologie
Hypermedia
Wort <Informatik>
Emulator
Aggregatzustand
Programmiergerät
Subtraktion
Sichtenkonzept
Momentenproblem
Natürliche Zahl
Humanoider Roboter
Linearisierung
Internetworking
Roboter
Gefangenendilemma
Virtuelle Maschine
Menge
Perspektive
Endogene Variable
Mereologie
Speicherabzug
Wurzel <Mathematik>
Optimierung
Neuronales Netz

Metadaten

Formale Metadaten

Titel Do Robots and Digitisation really fit the demands of an ageing society?
Serientitel re:publica 2018
Autor Wieching, Rainer
Grudno, Jens
Cosentino, Sarah
Lizenz CC-Namensnennung - Weitergabe unter gleichen Bedingungen 3.0 Deutschland:
Sie dürfen das Werk bzw. den Inhalt zu jedem legalen Zweck nutzen, verändern und in unveränderter oder veränderter Form vervielfältigen, verbreiten und öffentlich zugänglich machen, sofern Sie den Namen des Autors/Rechteinhabers in der von ihm festgelegten Weise nennen und das Werk bzw. diesen Inhalt auch in veränderter Form nur unter den Bedingungen dieser Lizenz weitergeben.
DOI 10.5446/36643
Herausgeber re:publica
Erscheinungsjahr 2018
Sprache Englisch

Inhaltliche Metadaten

Fachgebiet Informatik
Abstract Demographic change is ongoing in countries like Germany and Japan, as a consequence, societies and health care systems need to adapt. A possible solution to tackle this challenge of a super-ageing society might be digitalisation and robotics. A look to Japan highlights concepts like society 5.0, but does this fit for the European countries as well? Is it desirable from an ethical perspective, will it be accepted by the society and the citizens themselves? We will discuss those issues in our panel discussion with regard to IoT and robotics in the field of elderly care.

Ähnliche Filme

Loading...
Feedback