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hi welcome my name is extremely high said I am most of the session that lives that we talk about it on we have other things to discuss today yeah welcome to this panel and we're ready yet to be here and to talk about music streaming with you hopefully so before somebody showed introduction by let me explain they're all posts and modus operandi it that this house we call it and we will have a shot at production of same I will be joined by the street wonderful speakers here and states and they will give a short so uh explanation of their that their perspectives on music streaming and their projects which are very interesting and 1 part of that would be for example Andreana Peter and Andreas them and after that after those short lightning talks we will hopefully have like 30 minutes for discussion and we want to invite you to join the
conversation so after the talks have finished please and grab Mike if you have questions of comments and yeah just on our discussion a k come the question is why I am here can be learned University of Hamburg I'm a media researcher and naturally I'm interested in what people do with music or other stuff in online so this is part of my research is looking at pop cast this has nothing to do with streaming actually them maybe the connectors with Andreas was a good friend of mine and but I'm consumer of music and I'm a big fan of streaming services and it to give you an impression of how this affects my life on everyday basis these are 3 artists and Thundercats FK tweaks and was packed and on him who I've discovered wired to discover a weekly feature on Spotify and I not
only listen to their music regularly that's said I also go to the concerts by tickets and by
cities from them so these are just 3 examples from musicians and yet it came to me we magically y and the algorithm of spot fact and the answer in this study which has been published and with these 3 or 4 weeks ago and research in a cage hold that the adaptive streaming leads to very large increases inequality and diversity of music consumption so there are some hints
in the research that shows that that yet streaming music streaming really changes the way people discover music and also and the way they are exposed to different kinds of music maybe to give you some idea of the state of 2 stream as you can see on the left side of the artist uh this is an overview over the Streaming Service subcaption revenue in Germany and as you can see we had a massive increase in the last in the last years the last 2 or 3 years and and to as you can see
you know considering all the music say it's into halves and 16th and operative subscription revenue makes about a quarter of those music sales so we can fade office has really been established in the last years and when we look at the global market share of music streaming service services it's no surprise this Spotify dominates the arena but Apple music allocated about 20 per cent and then you have the user but all the active surfaces like a not so relevant placards but these are the most relevant services we're talking about today
Alan now German perspective to talks in English but we are in building and chairman sub slow when it comes to the adoption of the digital services and the distances Snapchat from the from last year's an additive online survey and as you can see them the we can see here music streaming services Armed adopted it that much but considerably larger adoption rates among younger and younger users so apparently maybe there's a change now I'm coming up in the next years other relevant services are music portal again younger users and adoptees and services a bit more than all the users and what I found really interesting that in 89 % of a young online there's uh I using uh music while you tube which I from strange but I'm not so young so maybe it is the same the behavior Tetsuya data younger people are more prone to and and obviously also music identification services are relevant to the relevant point of access to music OK this was just short overview of what's going on and the music streaming the arena and now we will begin with our 1st speaker
Andreana explaining her perspective as a journalist and musician and on music streaming and thank you very much and so welcome everybody 1st nice that you hear and so as a musician and my private life and as a journalist music journalist and in my business life I'm kind of a split personality and um during my time at the Rolling Stone I focused on newcomers and and when you write about a newcomer you where you have to provide to the reader is that you have to describe what the music sounds like so that the reader knows what this new artist is about for ends um I have always found its clients tricky and difficult to come to label music in a way that an algorithm would do because I felt like OK you have different criteria you have idea your knowledge and experience about music and then you have to describe whether something sounds more like a post-stroke or more like shoe gaze and um that brought me to the algorithm of Spotify and discover weekly which you may all know it's a service that is provided to to the heavy users but if every Monday the and um it's a playlist personalized playlists with a play time of 2 hours and about 30 songs and uh you can see on Twitter and we have slides here and we all I can do myself mass at the something yeah so these are
just 2 tweets that can be an example of how people on social media go crazy about discover weekly on they even want to marry the playlist because they find it so um suitable to their taste and I really wanted to know how quantifies is doing this how can they succeed to such a good striking rates strike rates an and so add that the the algorithm that Spotify uses for discovery weeklies is called Echo Nest um yeah this is this is the algorithm behind it and so Ackerman's works with 3 elements of the first one is the taste profile so despite you have to be aware that's but if I that collects every click that you have ever done on the service so money-fund fun as about every song that you have ever listened to
and at any time even the Nickelback songs and the sense that you probably do want to know people food to that you listening to and so you have a taste profile and um this is collected by the source that you click to new libraries and your your playlists of course and so and you have 1 taste profile and Spotify um compares your taste profile to all the other users profiles and so on if you have and of course there bubbles of other users who have a similar tastes like you have and if for example you have a playlist with 5 songs and other users of who have a similar taste let you have also have those 5 songs and playlists together with the 6 song that you don't know all the brought by now then it's highly likely that discover which we will should suggest a 6 song to you as well the 2nd element on which the the um algorithm is held on as an audio scam so this is what interested me the most because that's how music is deconstructed into minor key major key into speed into tempo change into but yeah instruments and all that stuff and what you get after these 2 construction is just a bunch of numbers and mattresses and it takes the weak force qualified to do the next to discover weeklies because it's so many data and and this is about how yeah how sound is being deconstructed into numbers um and 2 thirds while pillar the book the 3rd category on which the algorithm is built on that is the text so what does is that it scans all tags on the Internet to social media Facebook Twitter and if somebody is writing about um the new favorite bands on a face the post interface proposed then the texts can you can scan the words that the the user is writing and using for this description for example they can scan the words I listen to this new band it's my favorite song at the moment and then they can take the words favorite and amazing and listen to it and stuff like that and can tell what is going on viral at a moment for example or if the music magazine or a blog the and writes about a new band and describes how the music sounds like for example it sounds like I don't know
um all school here apart from the beginning of the eighties men texts can can tell that obviously this band sounds a bit like old-school music because a human being this label it like this I am and with these 3 elements Spotify can provide this amazing and very impressive um discover weekly playlists that is personalized your taste this is just a quick look on the uh um echoed tree and it's it's a bit saying
if you ask me but also very impressive because this is the genre taxonomy of Spotify of Eq honest I'm not I don't know if you can read it write yeah um it's it's you can see um there a thousand 600 genres at the moment I guess and you can you can see how those the machine put music and sound something that is very uh intuitive and emotional into labels and they're about names like C C M or be 64 and names for John was that I have never heard of and um and you can also see interesting links so what I found out through this uh geometry is that deep Taiwanese pop is very similar to German folks music so and contemporary country has a lot to do with the music that is labeled as whose pattern so I it's it's very interesting what the machine calculates on yes
so as amazing and sophisticated this algorithm may be of course and what I want to put into the discussion is whether this kind of music makes the listener lazy because and if you have if if you have these uh personalised tailored and customized playlists for your needs than everything that you have to do is just click play and listen to what the machine shows for you and there are critics for example then rats from the New York Times even wrote a book about it to say even if I like half of the songs in my playlist it always feels very flat and I feel in instant infant analyzed um to to to like to a child who is being who's been giving something in it and like in a very passive way and so on the and I can say the same about me sometimes I wonder how machine can reveal what I like in this way but there's something about it that still feels a bit wrong so yeah maybe you have your own experiences with this playlist as well um yes so these are the critics that I wrote down I'm sure they're much more and the I will be very happy to discuss about this with you this seems Arianna and except under
as the you a clicker against the fact that I a contest it has a PhD in media studies in the it it's not simply as case and there he's also had of analog solve 1 of her a final Excel and 2 will tell us something about how the experiment somehow streaming may change music itself thank you Tom yet so we are actually our small in labor from i th and the
labor is run by artists who on the label so all perspectives not so much like fiber perspective in terms of what we have money and promote music so where musicians without any money and promote ourselves so just to have this training of my perspective so when I say label them sorry guys have any 1 of you make music you don't have to pay much much so but what we want to find out was on wet as streaming as a distribution of music arm has the potential to shape music itself because when we discuss streaming we from another's perspective we mostly speak about the river you so because streaming gives you vary a little relay you out of it and this is like the most burning topic for as when talking about streaming but we wanted to put a step away from this discussion and asking ourselves and asking all obstacle network and on musicians
on if if they want to figure out how streaming might change to music and actually this this has quite history of armed because a lot of the things we know
about music and ever since music was recorded or distributed and on this technology and also those economical circumstances shape the music like come from the left at the dose wax roles from medicine and a hole in the size of them uh limited limited to time the music or try could run all the diameter of a vinyl arm it limits or it shapes by the length of an album some some of the most interesting albums have been year out of shape by this length for example things by attitude pebbles I just right on computers mornings for example and also what we should not forget as the radio like a a proper single is about 3 minutes 30 seconds and it has a ramp where the DJ could Spiegel and things like this and they're interesting the those things shape music as we know it's like the length of the single the length of the p length of the album and those on those are very surprisingly stable those conditions although the way we consume music changed so much on so and a very
smart person from the York singer-songwriter and also proffer some like aricle he just pointed out the question so what is the what is the bound the real streaming since it's not a time boundary right you can upload whatever length you want and you can upload albums with the thousand songs but the the hot on the read a hard limit of streaming
is the revenue like the business model and the revenue is like 0 . 2 0 . 8 cents per stream our and the interesting thing and that's what you pointed out you get paid after 30 seconds playing time and so he just and he figured out with this number and then just a question is a musician to his screw ourselves when we make songs that are longer than 30 seconds right should we sell a single as a 6 songs having a 3 minute 30 songs and then make 6 portions of of 30 seconds out of it and this question is a very clever and that they have been artists already own made use of this on the left you this Wolfpack mean already introduced
them as 1 actually discovered on Spotify they made this great sleepy project where they had an album with from 12 to 10 tracks and uh all of them was silent and you could run this album on repeat whole day all nite on a computer and they under revenue out of food and they ask defense to do so so this was sleepy and as the project from the UK punk rocker is and they made 1 album would 130 2nd treks and I'm really like this punk attitude when thinking about how how can we figure out how stream may change the music and then we asked our network to compose
songs of tracks which are not longer the what which I exactly 31 seconds like 1
2nd longer as you need so and yeah you can listen to the you can listen to the results on analog so the slash 31 seconds or what 31 s some but also to some extent does but this is me and with a or from a man and a mean in
indeed and lower in a pasture even the PA is not so bad actually but let's give it a good a 2nd try so this was 1 example and I
I took to to like 2 extreme examples that was 1 like give you a 2nd at a time in a way of the world uh and and here you have a thing of the of the of the of the of the world of meaning of so those are 2 examples of and you can figure out on this if I 31 songs and so but how does that sound what is music war of that 31 seconds long like the time you
get paid as an artist on-stream platform like Spotify for it and I mean you can figure out it's not not enough to establish a musical idea in a song that's what all Ortiz said it's a it's a nice meaning to play with but it doesn't feel like a song to that and it is not from the structures you could year on what happens is you get things like skits all tools or in trolls and almost reads like this pre-listening stuff you got on Amazon and items for example and and that stadium so that's to form that makes music pretty and that sort and that terms like industrial on and yet that was all big result of out of it that like the value of music doesn't stop after those 31 seconds after get paid it needs obviously more time there's something I want to bring in in our discussion on yeah what what effects screening has a music and how we might change business models in order to not have negative effects on the music itself thank you yes thanks and manage their
understanding of the 3 speakers and a speaker and Peter is 1 of the founders of resonate which is on a i ternative median streaming music cooperative and there we be a talk a bit about changes in artist payment and participants of you suspect Peter before you set to thank you so the question here is that with endlessly available content
words the gravity and music streaming connectedness with the artists this is something I discovered using the platform adult was I felt a new weight to the experience of music streaming get to what that's about in just a moment so 1st of all why another streaming Service and being Republic I get a cut of cut to the chase and say the reason is that we have a corporate
governance model for culture with the existing streaming services so the corporate business model detects and dictates what the um what the platform does and how the content is consumed
so with resonate we're going to do the opposite and that's to create a
cooperative governance model for culture and so what that means
in the realist terms is that everyone adjoins is a shareholder as a cooperative I'm I'm the founder and I have 1 share and has a label owner he's got share and I think technically got another share because you're also an artist distributing the loop of wire and all of in the uh fans as well In addition all the workers that non build code in such yeah why this matter is is that recently streaming as your past physical objects in terms of total sales and so there's a lot of speculation that because it's the it's been this rebound in the music industry that suddenly making the music industry profitable again that what we're going end up happening is that all of the other channels start color dwindle down organ end up with streaming and then there's gonna be consolidation in the streaming business and we're going to end up with a couple of access points to on music and it will become about ownership anymore it'll become about access don't have a lot of time to go into why I think that's a little bit disturbing but
but let's move on to talking about the different model for streaming upstream down and that's the the model beta right now and we've taken the whole thing and turn it upside down on its head when I found when I did
the uh my initial research on this was that the big problem with payments whether so much controversy around all of this is that with the monthly subscription model
it's really hard to reconcile all the different listening patterns and come up with a fair system for paying artists and so by moving away from monthly subscription and going to a topic model where you put down 5 or 10 years and we can do fair payments we can do the same payments everybody for every plane so basically what we've done is great we broke up the price of a download from over 9 place so you put in effect 5 a 10 year balanced and then you start listening and then for each time that you listen the same
song the price starts to go up a little bit until you've reached the nite play at that point you own the song you don't have to pay for it again from us and you can even access the file if you want to the really interesting thing about how the formula works is that you can get 2 distinct phases you've got a discovery phase in a fan phase in the discovery phase it's super-cheap it's actually it can be as little as 2 to 4 dollars a month and Europe I getting to know new work and new artists and then we get to the more like the fan phase you really like a particular song that any start paying a bit more and you reach the price of a of a download and this is where the gravity thing comes in and it's been really exciting to actually start working with this in like you know i listen like to 3 hours a day it's funny because you know they gave me the the catalog and I didn't wanna listen to it actually want to wait till I got in the out because I needed has the up and have become big
fans of a couple of your artists as a result of this model and I think that what we're looking out with this endlessly available content stream that comes from Spotify YouTube etc. is that there's not a lot of gravity there's lot connection to artists anymore because you can't just skip from 1 thing to the other but by changing all business model around to where these little microtransactions occurring you can look and see all that's the 3rd time I've heard that song in you know we at paid them just a little bit more than the last time I was into it and you could feel like Our hit the 4th and 5th listen of of this the same song and our like realizing and supporting the start is now because I'm giving them more money than they can make another platforms the math it for the regular strain market is pretty horrible you have to as it purely independent artists you have to have your son was you 150 times to equal but the cost of the downward and so while streaming on on the whole has led to more profits in the music industry and offer artists like is it's actually you are
suffering because the per stream rates that you get with these other platforms are so small that you're the chances are you never gonna reach 150 place on the same song by 1 found in order to reach that that price so this contact info and look forward to the discussion OK thanks Sir Peter and maybe yet and we click
to the next slide down to get these were actually our 3 of perspectives on music's training thanks a lot and as I said that we will now have also time
you have questions or if you have a common which to know much more about the we have a mike here and in the room have perfect OK just raise their hand we have someone who assists the best yeah um it thanks to your I think this perspective so kind of come together at some point and we will find our where these points are bad Arianna when read the Rolling Stone article on the whole Spotify calculates
the music taste and notice that you use to words to describe this kind of and a rethink and music recommendations creepy and just have refining he people and what is so scary about I mean discover weekly are a similar systems what makes you yen have might miss about artists and maybe sometimes I have nightmares that I like some of the songs maybe that's creeping um um well the thing as of the thing about John general
general maybe is that the music is about emotion I don't know that people who say all I like this song because it's a post rock song and it's not in by the no new gay song or whatever people like a song because they like a song and what an algorithm tries to do is to deconstruct the song into little pieces so that in into numbers and I'm I just find it extremely unnatural and um and even if if if some of the suggestions sometimes secured taste it's a bit and it's a bit scary that this machine is putting music into something like this because I M and also music taste changes by time and also on I think that John genres are getting less and less important some people are listening to music in different situations in different moods at different times of the 2 different forms of a day and so on it's weird to say OK here is this q rated hip-hop playlist and AAM you then you can listen to the public to always be you you don't and there is nothing to and to discover yourself anymore and maybe that's a bit weird for me that you have this is this John retreat which is very impressive but also not the way that people perceive music I would say the OK so that you you feel
like you're in many musical echo chamber of something like that so typical for the babble effects which accounts now also from music and musical tastes maybe and yeah but then we if we look at it from another perspective you could take a k now all armed these platforms they account for user's tastes and for the emotions and they like you want to get to know you all of this stuff here and it wouldn't it be and if you compared with classical music uh a at traditional radio details for example of the classical pacemakers when you say that decent these new possibilities to discover music uh are like a democratic station or liberation of taste making um
it is and they're all to this point that now but the users our yeah taking into account uh in and out of the 2 um well I'm and so the start and I'm not so critical some it in a way that I would say that people should not listen to to discover weekly or something like that I think and people always have the choice to choose the music themselves they can go out they can go into record stores and discover something themselves so um I would say it's of threats because you can also see this as an addition and of course I'm 20 years ago people went to record store and then there was the the uh the shop assistant and you also got suggestions from a person and then you were listening to 10 different records and then maybe like 1 or 2 of them and maybe it's the same with this algorithm you get 30 songs and maybe like 5 of them and then you're happy so I wouldn't say it's necessarily bad at the only thing that I criticizes whether some whether you can approach music from from this way whether you can say that you can put music into playlists just because the numbers of the mattresses told them so because of for example what what what genre are the Beatles or what John Ray is David Bowie where where would you put this and so I think that you can't you can't put music into those kind of numbers I would say but still of course it's a chance because you can still be your own person you can still choose yourself and you can choose wisely and maybe about technology in addition it's maybe it's the same discussion that we have 1 television came up and people were afraid that people won't read books anymore this is not true is something that is in addition and bones replace the way we listen to music before but maybe you just have to be very aware of the of how it works and the Korea yeah
because it's going to jump in on the this this notion of a logarithmic curation verses human curation and the point about human curation is that it's unexpected but I
feel very lucky to be pre digital when it comes to my experience and history of music and to me the the people that I really turned me on the stuff that was the things that they turned onto was so they no I was going to like and that the change my perspective about what you could do with whether you know the guitar and bass and drums or you know something else entirely and and I think that's something that's missing from this logarithmic curation I hope that something will be able to do and like you said to democratize curation away that puts that human knowledge back in because you know it it is the it's to sanitary that's that's like the Wal-Mart of to use an American reference the Wal-Mart of music consumption it's too generic and that I just want to jump in that you because of
picture 1 1 feature within Spotify some way you can do this like the user user-created playlists and for us as a label those user-created playlists they become so important on because it's 1 of the most important promotional tools nowadays that which that
10 years ago this would have been the music block then you would send it to the blogger which uh which would have been the taste maker and like the new radio DJ 10 years ago was a music lover and now it's the playlist maker and at the plate 2 and and then it's also human so on and some of them are like really really powerful like that on for example from the popular at 1 place German German Red best of German radical something which is monthly and if you have a tractor you know it has like 20 thousand places like almost instantly because the list as a subscriber so much users but on the other hand we just coming back to your question is this is this some not a democratization I would say this a problem because what are the economy kill and also like data are circumstances where where this happens in and this is not democracy at all because like peter mentioned in the top before we had at at lunch is like that the business model of Spotify is not a subscription it's like selling the data but it's technically it's about selling stock and that's what Spotify's business model is it's not about making money off of music it's about the IPO and but 1 of the main that revenue streams is around the aggregation of data profiles on on listeners and in but is at that point I want to come back later and that you will have resonate and works in open source and the assess and we find it interesting that we have a common to hear from the audience and acting against little repeated just mentioned but 1 to say hello Peter
administered in hand and I don't view the all because it's always the same thing has always been to 3 the same thing people tell you something and just mention that I don't feel that people don't look for something they have never seen I mean it's like all its EVA humans will always search for something and I wouldn't will not tell us we always search go for something it's always the same thing like when you listen to radio this new favorite you because you want to listen to the radio that's the other garden so I don't feel this and if you a music lover you will go somewhere and if someone is a music lover you send your link can tell you this is wonderful what I fear is the data that's the problem if 1 day you listening to Spotify and you listen I don't know maybe you listening to punk rock of today and then and then people know you political ideals so that's what I don't like about this side so Diamond from these perfect it's wonderful it's made by humans it's there to help you so what you just said the data collecting and you are the you are you giving data to people that make money that's what don't like then that's that's what I meant by the corporate governance small for culture is that the corporations sees you as that are set there and and nothing more and so that's why we're were pushing is totally different from perspective on that but what they did and it is it is very very scary I know someone who actually read the terms and conditions and left the the platform I mean who does this nobody reads the terms editions anything think it takes like 3 to 4 months if you read all the terms of for all the apps use would take 3 to 4 months of year year year you have to do it again the next year you have to read and understand from when you can't understand it to us as reading a yeah exactly and so and so the this is it this it's going to be really interesting what happens you really 2018 in the in the you know that that's going to have an impact on the way that these these businesses operate in terms of data collection we will see that has and Peter and as I said before and you have follow
mother and wrote I'd say with resonates regarding our openness transparency least this is what I on their website I'm could you explain a bit more on this what he to you are a book with data for example from while still very very early days so we are collecting data
mean because were were looking at the way that the player works but the when we really to go lies the goal is to be able to make everything opt in not opt out so if you want to be a fully anonymous user and not have any of your data and so you know saved how you could do that and so I know where it becomes that it and advantages that if you want to create a communication channel with an artist and see what URIs actually know where you are and because maybe you wanna get was show alert you wanna find out that the coming year town from but that this is a part of the Cooperative kind of models this is treating everyone has an equal number it is it was something I was interested interested in as well so how do you create this connection between our of artists and fans I mean this is something for you as an analog sold as a label on let's say network a platform which is interesting as well so the question of and local connections for example I think
you are part of the symplectic and the US and how how can these global companies reflect on the relevance of local specifics of such caches specifics for example and this is something that place a roughly as well as in and later work
in in the beginning of this whole home like in demand and streak stuff like when we started we set it almost 10 years ago I was thrilling for us to see while somebody from New Zealand played you of from Canada something which was like totally totally strange was that is really really small then the artists on but and we we figured out this whole world music blocks and then they had some of those those block connections way there was a network of international music blocks and each month 1 block trades the place of they created a Mumford playlists and every block out of this network and produces 1 track from the country and so we started figuring out how those connections work and how you how to get in contact with people on but the thing with streaming is but we as artists have almost no inside there is no Spotify that's there are some steps you can get into your albums or play you create but it's definitely not the kind of connection you get for example their on SoundCloud which which is something which works uh at least in my understanding and how all fans use it at all that the networks we are in use of more like a community where you share strikes where you comment on tracks where you comment on the music and this is something which usually doesn't happen on on those big streaming device big streaming services and most of them don't have any message got a message function or something but you can follow you can follow a profile but a profile cannot follow back in that sense because the authors preferred kind of follow back lisible us and so those those platforms became in in that in that sense that a setback for us in terms of creating connection because that this is something we've always been good and to create connection with the people so we have small fan basis what would high connection and we we did not lot lose doesn't mean but we don't get anything back out of it except from the revenue share we see in the end of the month where was it screen on which countries and so in the act of I'm looking forward if the resonates scale going to get bigger and more people acquainted if those connections like tweet like that Peter covering all music's through yet and reporting us on it will become more have a comment on that
well 1 thing that I wanted to say is that I'm talking about data privacy is that some it's not only about personal data but also data bubbles and we talked about this earlier um and lunch that some Spotify has the the uh information about
every song that is clicked by any person at any time ever since they at like subscribed on the on the platform and so it's not only about your privacy but also about some facts like Spotify knows which songs are being streamed in their Nikos on on a friday nite from 10 o'clock to midnight for example and so they know what kind of music people I can barely know current compared to Munich for example and companies definitely will be interested in this kind of data for example for advertising for commercials and so they know which kind of songs are popular in which area and I think that this is um very relevant for in terms of data privacy that bullet lead to
mean with all this data awaitable M and let's just said you don't actually have that much data on on the users past patent so I'm doesn't influence the shape and structure of popular music kind of necessary uh the the patterns that are most popular and musicians are like in orienting to stuff on on that is that are there plans for a Spotify optimized album so having having been to be note this kind of algorithm in an
analog way right because if you look at for example tools and nineties of deep it's our mainstream take no pop songs they they all those that sound like they with curated from algorithm right and from the kind of stupid uh group because on it at Institute in terms of how much mass goes actually into but so so if we talk about taste for example or what what is popular I think we have ever since music is um distributed of in a mass market since like the beginning of the 20th century we have those those algorithms already at work in a very simplistic way I would say to say like give the fall to the floor and and here we need arise in that we need a bridge and we need the level curves riff-raff and things like this and so on so but definitely um there would be people interested to have a algorithmically ideally shaped song like what went to pee and then then it would be interesting for me as as also icomedia media scientists also sociologist punish you what other criteria they put in to say this is a successful song and like I know the music industry do criterium would be when 2 people click away the so we will it if we have if you would have music generated by of of on based on this user behavior then it would be probably music just like like elevator music that would be music that that that does not disturb anyone but it wouldn't be music that inspires anyone the and just as a comment I'm thinking of young women mention Leontine's that maybe you've heard of this and it's the idea that just came into my mind that is a very good example for this so this is kind of a monkey algorithm yet in that case so can you make monkeys and decide upon the text of uh popular all book popped human so the bloody earworm by the way that's really can't see it so the monkeys set it up with very well set on that bombing took about remember we also talk about licensing and I'm not a musician I mean I have some you clearly tracks on
Spotify by an ensemble of its but and but this is a private matter so pleased included it them however and yes I am streaming I think and so when we talk about 3 years ago on as for example on may musicians and where the artists were like really concerned about going on Spotify putting the music out of base is mostly based on the on the business model so we all know this and think flight JC pulling all of all of his text from from Apple music as against Butterfly posts so a maybe Peter on can you tell us a bit more about why for example artists and musicians come to resonate and want to be part of the
cooperative and this is more about sustainable business and and getting more and then you are it's it's really also a political position or an idealistic step and this is so there definitely is a political asylum
sure I mean it as an electronic a producer myself who went through and that experience in the mid 2 thousands were in the spotlight heard rather SoundCloud change the business model and suddenly half of my catalog was gone unless I decided to pay them and for posting it's like this is the the prime example for me personally I think that most producers and advances have been through something like this with the platform and that's the that's were having some kind of voice this is fundamental and I think that's a big drop as well as the possibility that maybe will make more revenue but I hope it's also about that being able to open up more pathways in communication channels you know if a band comes to us and says hey were using this new app that allows us to send whatever to our fans could you somehow integrated and you know if as long as we've got the resources to do so and I would like to do that you know and I think that that could provide a lot more opportunity in the fact that they can ask that question and have it considered the maybe even like say well we get actually take that to vote because that's causes some
other problems so let's ask the community to vote on you know they're covered market democratic process you know you don't get anywhere else so I think that is a big appeal to white people are coming in he speaking of a stream of consciousness and consciousness of streaming I mean this is something you have to explain to users and if we look at the data and especially younger users are are really and we are enjoying the leisure is awful of having like a small amount of money in every month and paying their it you have to look like you lose the idea of what it means for the artists and when you stream his stuff on the speak platforms I think is so it's kind of
educational I'd say who will would you try to achieve a achieve I think we have just I think clear but running that out of time but of course you are invited to ask some questions so I wouldn't you have placed amendment the 2nd World and
there and peter I was wondering half how is the share that the artists receive at the end of the day with your platform because I think this is the main problem about Spotify not the 10 euros per month that's perfect amount it's just 9 years going to marketing 1 euro goes to the artists of well I mean actually the the palate is much more dramatic than that Spotify is paying out 72 like he's 3 per cent I think is the total number of their revenue is going out it's just that the the way it's being distributed a lot of its ending up at the major labels
and there's there's no and there's no quality in terms of how it gets broken down on the kudos to D 0 they're considering what's known as the uh listeners centric model which would make the distribution of funds based on what you actually listening to not the weight of the pious not divided out as part of Paris . com has the chart that explains how they do it and it's it's really complicated so and that's part of it with us it's it's totally 1 of them in terms of you know because it's a different process you're you topping up and so when the deduction occurs from a play it goes into the forest account instantly I'm I think in this that he had is another kind of on the right in this what they could be if we are
calculations are word 2 and a half times more can 1 a conservative we did really conservative numbers it was all the estimations
because we don't really know what we won't know for another 3 or 4 months into we're able to look at the the the data on it and so
Antoninus wonders also in another part of it quality like it you know you you mention uses skipping a track it like you halfway through and by having repeat plays in knowing how many fans you got that listening to 4 5 6 7 times and and paying that much more you do you really know who your friends are and you know what songs are really meaningful to your audience yeah I just wanted to add because 1 might think that I'm Spotify and all services on yet they like like they calculate like every plate so long as put the revenue but not a case like because what if i and you could go into this you could have a look at Google it's there was some interesting articles sporty kind was also blackmailed by the 3 big major labels will wide and and they had some specific contracts and they had to achieved they had to agree to output like Sony I would say 20 per cent on top then the other 3 major labels or something so every 1 of the big major labels has an old contract that's Spotify and in this contract is written down how much of the revenues going to the to the labels so some and and estimated 35 per cent of the music world right this music made by in these like x not
on built on 1 of the 3 companies they could label Publishing Corp's but and yet and and that's that's something we should not and we should of mixed together actually there there are not many services out there a lot like those who took that basic and clear the structure that you click it and then the artist gets paid that's unfortunate gets modest stand up model not yet from OK I think there was another question the if the density at the end In Greek commonplace a click
on the yellow cells wondering if you have any of this formal cipal owls wondering if you have any other revenue streams from your business model by let's say tracking all whatever it could be said tracking yeah like tracking all in like if you get receive any data from users and sell them to that's no that'll never be a revenue stream for us with no interest in whatsoever I open and that'll that as long as I'm running the company it'll never be there but there a lot of other opportunities where we can work with other startups and we get about 40 sign up and to to work with us in the future and for word taking originates were the RA about what goes on and on the opportunities out there in the and in the future it may be that streaming is just a loss-leader where it ends up being totally free but there's so many other ways for an artist to make a living that we don't need it actually charge restraining and that's that's an entirely as possible thank OK you happy with that of the things I mean there's plenty of time to talk about the business model the hand resonator after the system that unfortunately we're running out of time today come maybe we have a
Greek quick shot round of statements 1 of the biggest challenges in music streaming ahead we could RecLig something you
mentioned actually I think we need to talk about to explain to also to the artists and to the listeners better how these the services work and hold the politics and economics of 2 services on what he said and I would say listeners should not get lazy and but we also have the best of both worlds so from a cure it's a playlist and or a music journalist um can go to shows and see things that an algorithm can do that an algorithm can calculate in millions of songs that human being can do so maybe we can have both OK thanks Alan maybe we could enter session with something you mentioned in your article and too late which fits quite well to this year's Republic house motto and a lot of lot because apparently sparking not final allows you to check on tender and if there had uh if did a music taste self to potential subject and you music a taste it led to a judge's so it may be an as streaming is also something about bringing people together is spreading laugh and stuff like that so motion experiences yeah considering my own relationship and much of the research and how and where I want to encourage you all come to just keep on supporting artists of buying CDs and go to resonate so goes down Alex Stolz listen to an and as radical music of consonantal out and I really enjoyed it and yes keep on supporting the artists music you you like in care about because this is also something about love and not only about the bad data and algorithm and stuff so can thank you all for coming in here today let's give a warm round of plus and that of a plot of a speaker's turn this fisher yeah for their that's stress and my name is the of the flames and enjoy the rest of the conference on the
right around the and
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Metadaten

Formale Metadaten

Titel Stream of Consciousness
Untertitel The transition of music streaming
Serientitel re:publica 2017
Autor Bischof, Andreas
Harris, Peter
Zustra, Ariana
Heise, Nele
Lizenz CC-Namensnennung - Weitergabe unter gleichen Bedingungen 3.0 Deutschland:
Sie dürfen das Werk bzw. den Inhalt zu jedem legalen Zweck nutzen, verändern und in unveränderter oder veränderter Form vervielfältigen, verbreiten und öffentlich zugänglich machen, sofern Sie den Namen des Autors/Rechteinhabers in der von ihm festgelegten Weise nennen und das Werk bzw. diesen Inhalt auch in veränderter Form nur unter den Bedingungen dieser Lizenz weitergeben.
DOI 10.5446/33157
Herausgeber re:publica
Erscheinungsjahr 2017
Sprache Englisch

Inhaltliche Metadaten

Fachgebiet Informatik
Abstract Streaming has become the most important way to distribute music in our age. Although the use of Spotify, Tidal, and other services has become mundane to the most of us - including musicians and labels - the key questions concerning streaming have not yet been explored: How does common streaming deal with data privacy and our music taste? Are there a business modell beyond the proceeds of the big publishing concerns? How does streaming and its economic conditions affect the music itself? Three protagonists of music in digital times are contributing to these questions in the panel presenting and discussing their own innovative approaches: Peter Harris, the founder of the alternative...

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