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Smart and Rebel Cities - What's On?

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few yes thank you very much and I will ask especially to people about this
and I want you to ask questions as well and we've got an hour for the so that discussion and we will have a microphone in some way there uh which you can use whenever you feel like it's floor uh especially fo questions not so much common the other questions and not so much uh commons disguise this questions but actually questions and so my left is their Francesca but yes who is the OK let me think of my notes I get it correctly and chief technology and digital innovation officer at the city the city of Barcelona and also at the EU coordinator for the descent a project on direct democracy and digital currency test that is advising governments and companies around the world on the internet and innovation policies and to my father left I should've put you the other way around less than far-left no that let's see that to my far left is concerned because the Berlin State Secretary for digitization at this standards a Department for economy
and as an ounce of items uh the chest and neck he wants it to be but um the phone Executive Board of Wikimedia and also former Vice President cooperate cooperative communications at the death spun
foundations and also in charge of the and here we start the buzz words as smart city strategy of Berlin now uh will talk about that and how to find that the different uh in a minute um so
maybe our let's start with of bids um the now you've been uh in office for about a hundred days I think um and uh now you're in charge of the smart city thing and so on and what does a billion actually due to be smarts and what makes Berlin smart or a a lot of questions yes I am I am I started off as December 9 to be really precise um yes I'm I'm I'm
Permanent Secretary um at the at the Centre for Economics um energy and and it's of public enterprises I would say have never never looked up the official the official English translation and and yes digitalization is an important part of it because some you all know digitalization ghosts schools through all the Yukon nomics years and so part of my job is that it treats a look at at digitalization um to to started digital strategy dialog here in in Berlin into this together with other stakeholders in the Senate and to be really precise smart city is something which is located at the the nuts come slide uh um so we have to we have to find a good a good party do at this at this at this point and if we if we look at Barcelona at the moment I Barcelona used to be a smart cities if I recall correctly um and is not really a smart city anymore does that mean it's a stupid city what what is is Barcelona now right so I think our job is to get rid of the bats were immediately so that's what we can do and so I mean how can I also kind of new enough is actually have been nominated by our media at the canal last June I to be the digital commission meaning I'm in charge of defining their digital strategy I Information Technology Policy and aligning different vitamin syncytial tool and define the future of of of the a CD that's technologically but also that can serve the people and are the main reason why the peak on the only Italian in the Catalan Government has myself and they created the new role that didn't exist before so I'm now sitting in the government wide before the Chief Technology Innovation offers Emerson or with the technical are also would lead the technology company of the city but it was in part of the government and why I'm I'm also a woman which is I think a very important thing in industry in this sector this very much dominated I had the reason our high I'm dead was to completely redefine what is my CDs and how we see that in Barcelona and I think this is a lot to do with having a political conversation about what is my city is and how this should align with the policy of the CD and in particular how citizens and should be at the core of shaping the Digital and a common agenda of the CD which which means also rethinking technologies for the people and not just for the purpose of some kind of you know economic planning or some corporate agenda so I don't if you all familiar with the situation in Barcelona but I think it's good to remind a little bit the novelty the innovation that we having in the government Emerson on so our may here and comes from the popular movements and she used she used to be an activist fighting on a gains how selection on so she used to be part of a of the B condition are inverse known there was no fighting on this very criminal law there was anything I many many people in this limit never Hollis I she was elected into government after along a wave of globalization which is on names like the indignados movement or the 15 and moving to
Barcelona which basically represented big and social mobilization against austerity policy and against the corruption that are there was in a in their
political armed elites I would say and so she is out we are a radical new experiment in very new government where the majority of the people in power now in government and professor of mutations so she is coming from the I the citizen movement and many people in charge in the government are like that like citizens that are in the situation to change things myself from a professional politician so basically we
have just tool um rethink that before the the the experts I mean if you if you if you put it like that but you also have to know the the the novelty into the fact that we actually have citizens represented citizens in this situation and try to rethink the way that policy happens so why all this a introduction is before because on I think that the important thing about redefining this my ICT agenda has been I really rethinking government so rethinking how government works rethinking the participation of citizens into the policy-making process and then thinking technology much more as the tool to implement the policies of the government and not to basically it technology-driven policy where the government ban and up solving the problems of the technology instead of instead of basically solving citizen problems so we have a much now that I lining the technology to what citizen needs and and and start from there instead of starting from the technology 1st and this is a big change I mean it sounds it sounds like a small thing but it's actually a very big change and so the main difference I would think it this way there is no on digital revolution without a democratic revolution 1st which means that you really have to start work from deceit sense what they need and the other thing is that you can go we did technology 1st so although it is really important to think about infrastructure connectivity sensor and data you cannot start with that you can start rolling out that you have to start from what the city needs and a exactly what we're doing and how does that look a bit more concretely like how would you
actually get to know what citizens need and what do you do with yet was amended questioning 1st of all on our planet and that the moving away I don't think we reject the idea of this smart CT before does not see the mean that we
mean a technological CD we actually want to use technology to improve the the the the CD island I think are moving what we are talking about in our plan which is the Barcelona digital city plan we talk about torus technological sovereignity which is a concept that we really pushing forward to I understand how in this question of a popular sovereignty so what we really that is not just a state sovereignty where you know this state to just take decision on behalf of the citizens are toward a representative process that may be corrupted or not but it's really experimenting ways by which the citizens through participation and civic engagement can really be part of indicating the way where where this is going so this is a very practical aspect from has some very radical participatory processes that we're running out which involve a hybrid of online participation uh digital democracy were with an open source power platform that we built an off-line participation with citizen assemblies and consultation I know we had more than 40 thousand citizens that made proposals and ideas and participated to the shipping of of the digital strategy and of of of many key policies of the CDs from urban planning to culture to mobility I to a participatory budgeting so we have many different things that we do introduce participatory I'm process where where where citizens are are involved and it also means an basically as it as it has a very practical approach of I'm thinking for instance how do we get this citizens to know how we're spending the budget
no and this is a part of transparency agenda that's very much also at the core of how can citizens be more participating in this is 1st of all they need to know what government dust so this is not obvious to citizens because governments every opaque sometimes you know and this is a minute of most citizens but also for instance discount I mean these stakeholders that I that may republic great I think you should be the main people that should tell Christian what to do with the decided mean meaning I we do not only mean sea this the affected by specific policy I We
also mean you know people that make technology technology make innovation happen have the talent and should be part of this process you don't have to know what's happening we need to be open and so we need to know you know explain how we're spending our budget Spillane how procurement work so this is a very unsexy warrant procurement almost like taxation that you would be buried in the next spot but is very important because a lot of what government that spending citizen money to implement the policy and the reason that the way that you can make procurement much closer to people like you in this audience and this is what we're doing in Barcelona like putting closes in procurement contracts where we Monday that there is sustainability that there is a labor standards that the region gender standards that is you know variations on this so that smaller companies that have the capacity to help the government can run this big contracts so that they smart the the doesn't Ali become a tool for the big corporations that have the ability to understand how government contracts work and then to ram infrastructure large-scale infrastructure to run but in a way to procurement and to making this kind of regulation clear
and transparent we can make possible for smaller companies that have you know free software open hardware Open Data I mean all this stuff that you doing here to come and work with the city to help us building a difference my city so this is
just some of the of the way in which we actually implementing this on participatory approach to this my city and a great moment to remind all of you if you want to ask a question you can just raise a hand and and someone with a microphone will come to you um and if we look at the smart city strategy open and that was written by the previous government um the 40 pages mainly contain links to the technology and IT cook companies and if you look for an excellent so uh democratic ways
of people deciding on it and you you don't really find a lot of that and now in the quality onset out and then the coalition contract I guess um the coalition said that you once an update of that strategy can is a bit about uh what that actually means um yet we
we're we're we're we're just starting this process after have to say the current situation in Berlin is is is initially when when when when I entered office it was for me like a puzzle we have certain something in place we have 4 we have we have them a paper on a on a digital strategy we have the smart city strategy which is in the introduction of bad because it it is and buzzing the buzz smart city it bit because it's as well talking about what actually Berlin needs because we are talking about a city which is growing rapidly so we have to focus on issues like mobility energy and you need technology to to improve certain certain areas not for the sake of of of technology and so so the goal is now to to bring this to bring this together when we talk about digitalisation when we talk about smart city and and find a good way to to develop the midterm strategy and the detector for the for for for the for the next years and as he said this is this is what we what we read in the coalition agreement that we uh that we are going to do with this that we're going to do this on a participatory way so we want to want to talk about this we we want to discuss how to how to involve people in this and how to how to integrate the projects which are already labeled as smart city which uh which are actually going on in the city there's lots of there's lots of thing going on and with all different stakeholders and and the truck trying to find very very very exciting new ways and mobility or in how to create my my my local space and it differently we have networks smart city next would so our task is now actually to bring this to bring this in in a in a in a good way together and this is this is what we know what we know started to discuss actually it's not that I'm that I can sit here now with the with that with a long strategy paper at which is already finish with each other and she wouldn't wouldn't wouldn't be possible because of the center we we we want to do this in a dialog with her and now you're working for a city which is especially poor I'd say like
moneywise um and with with all of these um innovations coming to it's a smart city um there's always the question of of who pays for it um well maybe maybe to Barcelona who had a Barcelona Spain I am and I think it's a great great question I'm inference of because it allows us to do and also open up a little bit what it usually is that technological debate about and here's my CD which I mean in a crowd like this
1 it would be maybe out more about and you know concerns over privacy over information self-determination over civilians like saying you know this my city can look like the panopticon where you're monitoring citizens you aggregating these data the data get used intensively by few corporations but they consent would be mainly about Paterson surveillance I think there is another very important part and the debate that we need to have which is about the democratization of the data intensive economy and that's where I think not only we have to think about who is paying for this my CD but what kind of economic models and models of the future which is also by the future work is because it the tall and indeed the impact that this digital technologies are having on our life we will determine the future of the economy and the future of Warwick and start to you not asking more more questions about what is happening with their free stands digital platforms that they dominate the market i which is very concentrated and sometimes look like a big only got police I'm in the digital economy is very concentrated and that see what we can do to enable different economic models so different economic models for instance where data is not used as a commodity but they they is used as a public resource is a common good knowledge that data belong to the citizens and it's you know we should be protected with antiques and and and and and and all of that but also what is the is the more mutually the cooperative collaborative economic model that we can put in place i so immersed the lawn of a distance and this we open up and and I get to was paying 40 to because I know the question is also brought involves staff and public and private financing and all these different schemes but I think there is that there is something to say about the sentiments along now we have had and it's in the paper so everybody probably so it's a few problems with platforms like at B and B I mean there is actually bond in in Spain for the moment so we didn't have the issues but immediately tactics there a striking all the time that the hear the word order in and I in the question I would that be in the fight as is very clear I mean Barcelona is a government that's trying to implement really and progress the of our social housing policies so to increase the number of social housing make it housing affordable we're sending a lot about to control the price of housing because of event which is going up very much I think billion as a similar problem and kid this platforms like IBM beat as having a new back to reach that effects this kind of policies very much and and and and I mean they're taking out a lot of a residential apartments and into short-term rentals I We have problems because many of these corporations don't pay taxes locally I we have issues because and transparency of algorithms and you know this is not there and so it's very hard for government to regulate something that you don't know so I think it's actually very urgent to have it on a conversation about what that other intensive economies we can are put forward for the future but also respecting our labor standards I mean putting people not in kind of break arise situation and making sure that we using technology in data as a common good not only as something to be extracted by few corporations and actually there was there the 1st page of the economies of this of this week that reminding us which is talking about the new resource that you were extracted isn't it's not any more about the role material it's about data and there are only few corporations that can accept this data and then to artificial intelligence investment mine this data and use it to improve the world so we're going to rely on very few companies none of which is based in Europe and so it is a problem for us that can do this so I think as the this we can put for well and then finally I think on infrastructure and will confront this thinking you need the private sector on board I mean you need to collaborate with companies and you need to to make a strategy I think the important thing for C. This is that you have a clear public return so you know if there is investment and public companies the private companies are investing and doing they get it there is you have to make sure that there is a public returned for different CD and the citizens which is paying taxes of course and that that is not is active mothers that really disrupt on citizen like like in the case of a b and b for instance where where these initial and on and on technology infrastructure for sense personal is owning its own fiber network like we are how we have this property of fiber I we have laid out over 300 kilometres of fiber the very sensorized we have opened sensor network with open standards I mean the platform for open open our senses Urban platform of Barcelona can be used by billion by others see this it's open protocols is open Sundays I we on the fiber and we're creating a data platform that based on open source on open standards and its API are very well documented I think this is the way to go for citizens well which is about how can you manage our carbon technology infrastructure in a different way so that CT retains some of the control and then maybe maybe to say to 1 of 1 or
2 words about Berlin it's it's that that idea I don't see it anymore that that Berlin is not the city of innovation as well not not not not not the city on investment if you see this at the moment Berlin is is old growing um Germany by economic growth every every 2 20 20 hours still there's a start-up founded here in in in in in Berlin and half of the venture capital which is which is spent in in in Germany is invested here in Berlin innovations at you using using IT technology is that doesn't 12 per cent points higher than in the whole Germany did the you have all the conferences you have to you have the university so in the in many many many many players to want to invest in Berlin and want to want to want to create or or help help developing the city in smart intelligent way further so there many people starting projects in the city and all different all different scales OK
now we've got the same questions was microphone AcconcI's my idea uh OK so I've got 1 here and 1 over there thank you very much appreciate uh particularly precision by a Barcelona Franziska and laying all pure approach democracies leads technology and making references the practical tool of participatory budgeting this in a very concrete way of doing that which is through crowdsourcing that different alternative project are being presented and then this is made the decision making process for allocating resources uh and my question is whole for are you willing to actually walked on this role the Paris risks involved because of small rule can dominate and minorities may not be adequately reflect that but at the same time it would be a way to get all of the just standard budgeting where you basically continue just what has been done before with little changes up and up and the you can do that is theoretically OK
I'm thinking you need to to to experiment with different with different models and 1st of all I want to go back to what I said before I really we are running I our main innovation Barcelona is happening in how we are changing government itself I mean our thinking that which is what you said how far you're willing to go I mean we are and I mean the beer the coalition governing Barcelona is really coming from citizen movement it's a very different way of thinking about government where it's citizen participation is the core and the mean value of what we do and this is not just for technology it's for the key policies they were running if it's an affordable housing if it's a sustainable mobility if its energy transition if it's you know urban planning and in for instance the main participation process was run I mean on the government agenda is a set before but the other 1 is in urban planning so Barcelona Zapata disclose superblocks which is very am actually very normative urban planning process where we are restricting traffic in the different areas of town creating in blocks where cats cannot enter and this is also for a and C O 2 emission and to control pollution to create more pedestrian roads and and green spaces and all of that it's radically changing the city so we have done that even when he was implemented to a very large scale participatory processes where 1 part was budgeting so 1 part was about putting out budget and get communities to choose and prioritize the way to spend budget but other parts we just discussing you know how should be done on how should be implemented way should happen I mean you have many different things that you can discuss a in money and participatory but is it just a part of that and so on and I think you know in terms of you're willing to fight you're willing to go I mean we are going pretty far in way of involving the population into these and a participatory approach is largest online where you see your there is only a minority of the population participated I mean we are finding very different ways to involving the citizens to assemblies to consultation getting out industry them in good going into the neighborhood level some of the participatory processes happen at neighborhood level where you really go to people that they would usually participate in the process so and this of course with the they have a policy program for which we've been elected so of course there is still a top down approach which is about defining the lines of the policies that is the reason why we we had there so you always have that kind of balance but I do think that the participatory and also budgeting process there were running very successful because also citizens summing field not only the contributing ideas and and and so on and you know what really giving some kind commons to sometimes but they also contributing where the budget is allocated and then they can track and monitor how pages are implemented so you know it's it's in reaching I think the democratic process don't have got another 1 here and then
the back 7 1 year thank you and I I I I was wondering how you define the limits of smart city especially since a product the superblocks concept when you say smart cities of the technological thing for you is it a general erm planning livability thing and like to direct this question to both Barcelona and Berlin um and secondary how do you publicize these efforts because I think of literally heard more about possible most efforts in this area than anything from Ballymena livable and so they make sure that it's because of the
size of people involved yeah and it's a good question it's no it's it's it's it's it's part of the debate we're we're we're we're we're not on we have that we have we have smart city defined in the strategy paper from 2015 really really really in this a definition I can't I can't recall now know precisely but what we what what what what what we were what we are agreeing on that we are looking into this initially actually asking is is this the definition from the definition in from the project which I which I which outlines says so what we what we agreed in the coalition is to start at to start a process
that out in that that the part about publicizing things in Berlin is is something something where I'm still learning we are we're working many in in in many ways in silos and on on the on the ground level in the in the in the southern districts of Berlin but as well in the in the in different houses of the Senate them and trying to find because this is something you have to do talking about digital talking books smart city trying to try to find ways coming out of the silos that starts with data it's that it it goes farther with information we do have a platform where you can participate in certain processes but more not all processes of documents that they're not all processes are um are handled there in a similar way so to ask ourselves actually help to to make this a better and that at a place so from from from Oberlin perspective I can say and it's on the agenda and we're we're we're looking into that and they are I think that I mean
contexts where I did it that terms were CD keeps have being used speakers and basically there is just a market that's created around it and you know you have a lot of conferences that was mostly actually better known as the
most 1 of the biggest of these my city acts that is going to happen in November have and that's a reason why you continue to use this word is I mean we all know that there's more city was rendered by big technology firms I mean I'm Cisco EBN Siemens and so on that had strategy that was very much technology led to gas and so on and they the definition of summer CD was a mean about the beak and an urban redevelopment plans with technology was a beep idle read and you'll have a proprietary operating systems that run you know different urban processes now I think that we had a point where connectivity data sensor and AI it's pretty on will be produced so this CD is instrumented with all of infrastructure this technology and so it's very hard to disentangle what you do for instance in your energy strategy all what you do in year urban or mobility policy or how you were thinking about you know water management or waste management without thinking about technology and that's where I think it's a problem where we are not able to link the technology with exactly how we're running our infrastructure and our public services that acknowledges a part of it so the conversation shouldn't just be focused on the technology should be focused about what kind of system the we want free since about you know energy what is our energy system always running the energy network what is the business model uh what or how how we providing the services to the citizens how what is the management of gas and acknowledges a part of this so if you forget technology then you end up in a place where the big technology firms said the ones setting the this strategy and not to see the anymore so I think that the technology can become I mean as as I was saying before for instance have running the technology infrastructure in a specific way of making sure that you have a data strategy by which you know ownership of data that is guaranteed that you have at that you use encryption have but not for the rights of the citizens that use the data to enhance the public services and in all of this can be improved the way you ran on your on your on your policies and so basically I think that they cannot be a lot of what we do now it's about data in Barcelona is really about redefining warns the data are added season in charge of the citizens basically on all these data did they for what the data is used for it and how we can use the data to read improved decision-making processes and to really improve public services and we can be sure that you know this strategies shed because I think this is 1 of the core issue of the digital economy will be around this and not democratization over data so when we talk
about ownership of data uh um and we look at public data own well of process by administrations I think 1 of the big challenges is that uh a lot of people working in administration think that the data very well with is that right and so this and I think that goes to you and you see a lot of challenges with that in Berlin would actually still trying
to convince the the administration to to open up yeah I uh I would say that's
that's that's the biggest the biggest part of this whole thing we we we we do all of that we do have Open Data here in in Berlin we have open data platform I think we're 1200 datasets on that which which which is which is not a looking at the data potential of Berlin and and what you what you could think when we would be what you could do and think about about data it's not it's not it's not a lot of and into yes you do have technological problems you do have data silos you don't have a have a have a common common technical Open Data strategy but the major thing is this is a culture like you described it and to make it normal to think how to how to actually make data usable usable and published data make it available and enough to protect its now it is in the big the big issue with this is of course you had you had that you had a you at some years and in public administration and where where where the people working there what what we're limited limited limited so public administration be and got smaller and smaller so you have that many so when you when you look at many processes we are we're we're we're we're still discussing how to make the process work itself and and not to extend the certain a certain process which is in the head of many many people something when you talk about open date I have to do something extra have to take care of I don't have to take care that somebody is getting a certain license or that that that that that I I run a search process they have to do something additional and actually and talking about the value behind this not not not not just as a public good but for the administration itself at this this is certainly a big big thing we have to we have to do and that I think I think we're we're we are not lot on such a bad way we just introduced and the government law in in in Berlin which is which is rather good which which incorporated open open data and and what we what we started the 1st 100 days actually this cast as the major fuse and Open Data for Berlin to actually get it into into law and discussing this means as well to talk about processes to talk about culture and how to actually implement this in in in Berlin because it's not just is not just a legal framework you you you you need to talk and talk about the it if you
can run it to to the cone of the yeah and and then over here there was a thank you very much very informative I wondered if you could talk a little bit about can't institutions in cities across the world or do they have the tools at their disposal to be able to create new offices or on the human resource level for important for data protection both porcelain and
Berliner I think special on some the city cultural but if this is in the city you second-tier city a random country using the strategies we're talking about how to use the Council's and you state institutions overseas the councils to think that institutions currently have the capacity to absorb the oversight for smart cities or do we need re-conceptualize the way that also protections built into institutions to ensure that even if the worst people were to get hold of the system that would still be safe to individuals but I
think that you know within you are Data Protection Directive of for instance in Barcelona we are already you know cited in process of making sure that we do our impact assessment our with all the critical infrastructure that we're on and you know we do have competent people inside administration but also you have to understand I mean that seriously this really work as an ecosystem most of the time so if you do not have the competence inside and you always
have the institution or a way to link to local academia or our university research or expertise locality to help the city to do the job I think when it comes to data protection actually usually see these are very well connected to this recession officers and the Anderies expertise around the legal stuff now I think the challenging thing there is to link their legal part and the jurisprudential part with the with the technology and the and preaching technologies and all the real technology that make sure that this is implemented right and also the processes and so we have reasons now working on that now we have a project that uses and their looks at distributed data architecture looking at blockchain but also how to complement that with security and encryption and using attribute-based encryption when is about on dealing with personal data and I think I mean hopefully we're not the only 1 I mean we're really thinking about this kind of things right now and because we think this is very central to the to the to the policies because everything is data intensive so that you're not aware of it you know CD rom processes you can call its my senior you can call it some something else digitalization is happening I mean we have low the case of and Germany we have a national low where digitization is are basically you know is rolling out at national level the see have to implement a them in this means introducing the payment system digital like these are you know making making sure that everything is kind of getting digitalized so at the core you need to sort out your data strategy making sure that you have been this citizens right at the very core what you do otherwise I you're doing it worse than I yeah then that the companies but I think the capability has to be built also in this situation because I this edition can guarantee that citizens rights are respected and if this doesn't happen mean you miss a Derby corporations have better ingenious yes that's true but they have less incentive to keep their the citizens right at the core what they do because the monetized data so the institution can really do not look at how do we build that the citizen right at the core because we wanna provide public services in return so there there is an incentive there to do it to do it well
and I can add from Berlin perspective when when when whenever a new project in Berlin is introduced like we're we're we're we're currently currently expecting a project where you where you test automatic driving them around the brunt OK or and when we talk about an energy project which is called we note that the data and data security is always 1 of the biggest
issue which is which is which is which is checked them why why why well looking at this at this project so this is this is always always an issue any family had them and this
this is not the only capability you may lacking government for instance I mean we have we also migrating and I we have a migration towards open source of open source software in this city hall of Barcelona I because we think this is more
effective is more efficient is a lousy this to reuse and the applications they produce reuse services and it avoids lucky it allows interoperability and all of that and I mean the thing is they use the you you still have better competence when the city way investing in this so if this is investing in a free and open source software they invest also in the capabilities to to run this process if you extend analyze everything and you start using Oliver right the system then you rely only a few providers then you lose your capability so I think the entire digitalization strategies which should be about building this core capability inside and then work we did the system to make sure that you're providers are partner and they're not like you're not only you know contract the even situation where the CD is just in the hands of few providers so it's really about changing this relationship with the providers and make you should see this have the capability to run this kind of processes and you know you don't depend on any provider in particular at run your services so this is actually an organizational issue which is pretty complex but that this is what I think digitalization is about
and thank you and this really fits well I think and because I just think that the smart cities the whole approach is very business driven up to now and if we have more democratic standards I think that is really crucial and um is there a sort of best practices list we could exchange between Barcelona and Boolean because I think that would be really nice to have uh and to push the criteria for public good for public interest and talking about data ownership I think we really should talk uh much more not only about public data by government and and what is have I don't administration um but also about data traffic data data of nature and so on so on so that we do not and privatize all these data but have new approach of how to share this data and how to govern the state I'm in a whole I think it's extremely interesting to to have a new approach of smart cities that enables citizens to own and use the tools of the digital tools for example in Berlin we just had uh um our data protection officer said well uh teachers are not allowed to use what's happened but what is the other tools we use and also so it's great to say this is against the law but it would be better to have good tools so if we have an exchange on this and say here is a good practice here a good tools here is a good strategy for open innovation open standards for the government and administration as well as other institutions which are relevant in respect to public interest I think this is so important about the smart city approach thank you well when
you what would what would what we can say to to I'm currently expansion learning alone learning a lot we we have met before and we agreed on sit down after what's exchange such analysts yeah I know mn images to I done that I think of this best practices is not just the you know other change a mean of course we're planning to have this exchange but I think that set certain practices leads to much more of the creation of this capacity for collaboration free since now that we're on shifting to open source and we're starting to create a capacity in government we as a sub publishing date the called on the top and you not ask communities like this 1 to contribute because I'm a big believer that you cannot do this kind of participatory agenda a few that have this kind of people here with the technical capacity and data innovation ideas to work with them so we need to have the right infrastructure and the right tools for collaboration out there because so we can yes of course staggered the citizen needs and work for citizens to address the main problems and challenges but also you know get the involvement of the community that you need in order to develop these tools because some of these tools are available at some of the cells have to be built you know and so you need you need this but talent coming together and work with the CD not to make this happen and so I'm going to be very aware of where where I am now working which is the the government sometimes it's the problem using the city government you know not always but you know it's like we don't have also the processes for being very collaborative in this way because it's it's a kind of a close and structure when it comes to collaboration so we need to experiment on the framework they made this collaboration possible because we do really need to work as a community to build these tools that are needed and yet the
woman then the yeah we have quite a lot of men asking questions already and you get you the above that few and and the lady from Barcelona thank you for your and presentation and and I wanted to ask you what do you do if you know how do you
stimulate existing governments or the city counselors you know it actively change and look outside for resources because you just stand explained for example the technology is a key driving and policies distaste for example about that force us to rethink and how we were yeah and how do you stimulate an existing government constants and so on and to Eq taken from actively now change how you
have been working in the past 50 actively look outside for contribution in your in your city because I think that it's really that so much behind you know they're driven by technology that they haven't actually changed it and have negatively it to flee done something to actually um not all cities but a lot of cities because the government departments and they're very low not very flexible so state state fatalities and you I mean you're inside of these apparently you make these policies how do you stimulate your own government departments not saying yeah I this is a really critical I think and I
mean you cannot do it without a public workers and so we have really mn a pint of that kind of digitization so we focus on getting the public workers on boring board and I always talk about that we want to achieve a mean we have a grand vision yes so we want a democratic CD we want to get there where we change their relationship of power and all of this but actually what we are really not reversible changes which means you know that you introduce small changes so they wanna look like and this kind of big vision but their practical and there's small and very high to undo so I think this is what we're all working on that it's not easy to do these things in government because they're not prepared I think this is part of the democratic deficit that we have you know and when you ask me what do you do to stimulate the government I mean what's citizens due to stimulate the government this is the question because you know it will never change bytes itself because you know you have to add the pressure to change things and this pressure has to come from you know from from from the Citizens I do really think that and then once you are inside of course and you you start with this and question of of culture understand their organizational problems never only with the technology because that's I think what we both are saying the technology is never been the most important thing is always the organisational processes that culture the mind set the capabilities and then you know the will of course they will they will have to be there and that's political but when used this is this is nice what you say but the technology is pushing certain areas for example taxi drivers or creative people and they already
suffer from the changes so they actually you know and the government apartments on they don't recognize that yet in the and the way they were going over you know and and therefore the technology is actually pushing the the change absolutely but what I think what we're saying is that it is a problem where you have a technology-driven disruption that doesn't really match what what what people need so you can have you know really interesting technologies which are used by all the RBM the which is about platforms and how they operate and you can use data but of course if you only users to maximize the return of the company and then you don't take care of some labor standards you don't take care of what happens to the citizens you don't take it you know this is not an innovation which is sustainable in time and that's why a lot of people are pushing back so I think it's about understanding technology and understanding how you can use it to enhance the public good and this is this is all this conversation that we have in here and I mean already that we are talking about these and the conversation I can tell you is happening with many other CDs maybe a question is what is happening faced with sit then with government because I can I can see that sometimes this is as the most dynamic 1 that I'm taking on a lot of tasks and initiatives about what government don't tool and this is also the one minute with Barcelona we've seen this recency migration policy I
mean the government has is a terrible migration policy and we've been spending forward you know to to say welcome into the migrants and to give buildings of the city and to make you know should that so he died he was there we're doing that improvising basic services that the government doesn't provide any more I mean we're dealing with real needs and real services that people need and that's why I think there is a dynamism in CDs that should be exploited and the technological conversation should be right at the core of and some and most mn many times is not there and maybe maybe maybe 2 this that I would I would disagree that this debate is not
going on this is the these issues are discussed and the pressure and and I would agree on this especially on cities as high we are we are growing there's this under the microscope many many things on on on the on mobility on housing where we have to find an answer and how how to how to how to how to how to play this into the administration means to have it have a sender and to to have a clear answer on the which in which way you want so things because this is how I experience I I'm new in the administrative world I'm I'm loaning out how to deal with the with the with the administration it helps them to have a clear answer on on on on something if you if you say I want to have things on a collaborative way I'm I'm I'm I'm at I want to have a want of projects implemented in a way that that we discuss about this and you can live this and it is possible to change administrations as well and to foster the source or true and to push certain certain certain debates about it's a small added to change a culture interchange certain established processes so this is a very long way I think 1 more question because that wasn't that the right last let's find it along
not have a selective 1 more question from here and then and so running that thank you very much and not to be anonymous um I mean is knowledge strides smarttutor initiative from Frankfurt and then I would like to
question the whole notion of smartness and I think we should not have smartness as a goal that we should have like a humane sociable cooperative city uh for the citizens and so I think we should go away was the term smart city and that's also the talk of on the title of my talk I given tomorrow at 145 front stage 5 uh beyond smartcities starts humane sociable and cooperative the and I like to introduce a bond issue here which hasn't been raised another pretty surprised here because when you have a smart service being offered to the citizens so there is always a trade-off between the type of data you providing as a citizen and the type of smart as you get to and so I think we have to introduce much more the term privacy here which I haven't heard from you would you just talked about the data protection but data protection could something different as privacy because privacy is where you decide what kind of data you're providing and so I'm wondering what especially like Berlin uh if you have any plans to make privacy by design as part of citizens and design a goal for your efforts and it could be also EU is P 4 billion than all other cities also in Europe to say the services we are providing an hour court cities up Privacy by Design Services what you think about this let me
let me look it does it can be used he Frankfurt Frankfurt has already is already doing this and what we what what we're going to do in the 1st step is actually to to define Open Data 1st of all where we where we where we I agree sometimes we are talking about about privacy there but if she took to to answer the questions 1st how how to how to move forward with with with with data in this in this in this city generally it might be it might be that privacy is there is there an issue to I can tell you know I want to look at disappointed me I may not have like
actually something a bit by and for me wages as the controversial images would open a totally different conversation and then we have no time because I don't think I mean of course presence here by designing should be embedded in the infrastructure in the way you design Teknologi agree and is also part of the protection regulation I also think that they add national presents itself should be expanded to understand the type of debate that we having here because it's the individualistic notion of privacy and unfortunately that doesn't on I mean doesn't enable us to lead to some of the power free sense of the predatory platforms that operate you know today and this is because of this question all of the collective rights you know and that's why sometimes data protection work better because that is the
fundamental rights bound a approach which is there is because it recognize also some kind of collective rights that enable us to think about the democratization of the economy as well which is by the the conversation that we never have because you know the reason is that we talk about privacy and security which will be offered as a service by the same corporations that created the problems that we need to to fight so you know by itself it doesn't it's not enough to prevent that we have in this super power of predator data-driven platforms and we're seeing it now operating where the market will just that give it privacy and security solution if you're rich enough to afford it why we think it should be fundamental right and there we have to understand some new collective rights there there around data and so reading the ownership of it for instance in Barcelona we talk about data as a common but I think that the the issue you know as we're we're we're done with the I'm I'm sorry
but we're not done with the discussion of course only this middle and and and we will and I think it has just only begun and especially in Berlin um and if you're interested in um pushing this discussion a bit more if you're interested in this whole debate at please look up the new draft transparency law that the Open Knowledge Foundation has published today uh which goes way beyond the scope of open data but actually open processes as well and central documents that have to be published by the city and look it up it's an Open Knowledge Foundation all Berlin dada constants because it stops the the and I wanna thank very much out to discuss and Francesca and could stand for coming here and how high how the
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Metadaten

Formale Metadaten

Titel Smart and Rebel Cities - What's On?
Serientitel re:publica 2017
Anzahl der Teile 234
Autor Semsrott, Arne
Bria, Francesca
Rickerts, Christian
Lizenz CC-Namensnennung - Weitergabe unter gleichen Bedingungen 3.0 Deutschland:
Sie dürfen das Werk bzw. den Inhalt zu jedem legalen Zweck nutzen, verändern und in unveränderter oder veränderter Form vervielfältigen, verbreiten und öffentlich zugänglich machen, sofern Sie den Namen des Autors/Rechteinhabers in der von ihm festgelegten Weise nennen und das Werk bzw. diesen Inhalt auch in veränderter Form nur unter den Bedingungen dieser Lizenz weitergeben.
DOI 10.5446/33058
Herausgeber re:publica
Erscheinungsjahr 2017
Sprache Englisch

Inhaltliche Metadaten

Fachgebiet Informatik
Abstract What's Berlin's digital strategy for the next years? How can technology lead to more participation in democratic processes? Where do we need joint initiatives by actors from the economy, civil society and politics, to ensure a sustainable, participatory and efficient digital transformation? Which needs and ressources does civil society offer? And what can we learn from other metropolitan areas around the world, especially Barcelona?

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